David Driscoll

" Commissioner of education David Driscoll David welcome. Thank you thank you for joining us stay about the had a great weekend I had a great Protestant and a great week good for you you deserve it cannot only you've got a bunch of grandchildren as well. I got a few grandchildren and 44 nieces and nephews so you know families. They compatible. Alive Driscoll before we don't have to go much for the Irish -- 44 nieces and nephews pursued to be a 144. Got a couple of the -- life's basics down pat don't wait. Who did you David UK a great two join us I want to start right in on amcats if for no other reason David and out of several topics always current and some sometimes controversial. The governor recently appointed a woman ms. Kaplan from Brookline. Who is seen as by -- as an -- cast critic you bend it's really up an outspoken believer and supporter -- tell us what you see as the benefit. The good. That is derived from having an MK has driven curriculum and and guess based diploma."

" Well -- some I think the first thing is we need to go back in the context understand why it came my way to begin with the education reform act. In 93 was really in response to a nation at risk report commissioned by President Reagan. Which basically tell the American people we will fall way behind the rest of the world and reforms that it enters state's guiding document coming here. And so the key issues was the fact that our kids. Even here in Massachusetts where graduating from high school will -- Thomas. And didn't even have basic skills in English and math -- we had these horrific stories from. Employed is and others saying they could even make changes and -- in restaurants and so forth and so on his they have high school diploma -- said zero. Education reform act was to both provide accountability and the resources as you well remember a couple of billion dollars in money. It's such that we're going to test kids in major subject areas in grades at least grades 4810 and passing the tenth grade test. Was going to be at least one criteria for getting high school diploma so that's where it came from and I think. We kind of forget what the where it all began it began because we really weren't holding its standards."

" And David you mentioned -- an -- greatest part of the account I'm sorry the testing protocol of the testing regiment that students are expected to go through. Is it what do you what to actually teachers what to the frontline educators see from those tests. -- cannot help. Them focus and is it is it as. It does it become as much a diagnostic tool in your experience"

" as a good that's a very good point him -- saw 748 tan I said that's actually edited six grade math because disclose dropped out so much and forced them. A -- want to see what happened six of course along and no child left behind which the -- as such requires us to test in 345678. Which is really a lot of testing and it is a diagnostic tool every question on the test relates to standards. And the teacher gets a complete breakdown of every student and how they did on every question. Even to the point where to get remarkable church wanted to tell you which insures that the truth of the -- chose. And and try to touch you can get a sense of where indicated in the extra students strong and weak. The problem is quite frankly that we give the test in the spring the result style -- basically into the fall. She really dealing with next years teacher if you."

" All rights is a little bit of gap is easier way -- I think terrorism and and I want to go back to this three through weight which is required in the Coachella line. I mean the one good thing about and and it -- for the next couple of years will be doing that. And we can then do what is public role model and and particularly from the urban areas to comment makes a big difference because if you probably hit the in and out the mobility rate kids will be in denial. Very difficult to be held accountable for kids about the aircraft that you begin and so. A -- models says okay here is with a it was in third grade. -- in the fifth grade sixth grade seventh grade you can you can actually see at the district is making a difference was that kid overtime right now we test. This year is fourth grade clashes were traded next is portraits so there isn't that following an individual child but so chilled but but I think eventually hopefully first of all we can go on line with a lot of the testing some states moving in the direction. And and I don't think ultimately we have to test every grade I I just think it's too much. It was something required under the no child left behind -- didn't contemplate every. So combination of not doing it every year and on line I think we'll make it more manageable right now I'd have to say it is so a time out to test frankly."

" And and David a looming right around that caught -- know that you and the others you know the state has added. A science component social soon enough it will be. More than math an English -- will be science. Tell us a little bit about that and when if at all the UN vision may be a history all language component being added as well."

" Yes well it's as good a lot of people realize foreign language was added the government -- the added that one my children receive that like arrangement. We we do the scheduled for both science and social studies. I -- and there will be a lot of pressure because it was getting to an earlier people say it's really too much testing. The sciences Ke -- falls way behind the rest of the world. It's -- typical story we do very well in Massachusetts we almost lead the country even in science. But we lag way behind the rest of the world like I call combustible alot so. We need to get to the sides testing kids need to become much more proficient at science -- in the world. In the way it's going to if you will so we we -- schedule this year we will give the first results of science its preliminary and then we hope to institute -- science program including the graduation requirement was in the next couple years."

" We're talking to David Driscoll he's the commissioner of education here in Massachusetts has been the commissioner since the onset of education reform back in the early 90s so has a body of work and experience that is unrivaled. David will be going off into our glorious and well ahead to retirement shortly. And big big pair of shoes to fill. We wanted to get him a hero on tuners forum to talk about a wide variety of issues and a little bit later to take some calls as well. -- asking this question people talk about and cast creating such pressure on kids high stakes they can't get the diploma so on and so forth. It could be linked up for me if you can the drop out rate which I know has bothered you prologue time. And -- cast some people say amcats is driving the drop out rate to unacceptable levels. What do you say in response to"

" it's just it's just not true but I really get back to the pressure of I'm get a kick out of this precious thing people sentiment he would put too much pressure on kids these are the same path to sit in the stands and watch the kid element of the gymnastic team more at the foul line with no time left in him and preacher -- this stuff. I mean impressions in the the ball holder this is -- to pass them guess is really an age -- given that the tenth grade level and you know we have to recognize the rest of the world. Is not worried about pressure on kids -- it's a reasonable a lot of pressure it's not unreasonable. If kids do their work and parents to this job that I can have a problem console first of all find that that's. You know making -- Lou where it would not -- We're not developing the mental toughness and I kids that we need to -- baby actually continuing to talk about the poor kids today. Please they go from September to June as if they were on flaps at least -- and when founding fathers -- advocates worked on the times and good reason not to go to school from June to September so. That's one thing that the drop out thing is is just false and in the dropout rate has basically stayed the same spike last year. But not because of them cast in fact -- coming all of the report next. We eclipse has more than 65% of the kids who leads have already passed the English and math and cast -- so. It just doesn't it just doesn't follow it it is for some kids academic problems is a big as a big reason to struck probably get their bulletin Nazi unique. Connection between what tailored -- them immediately drop out that can be also and to SS Providence. But there's nothing to show that -- gases. Is a major factor in the drop the rate either going up but that's basically stayed the same we've been testing since 1990."

" David you mentioned a nation at risk he mentioned the fact that other countries really don't. Shed any tears about how tough how much pressure -- kid's face you mentioned that it's really an eighth grade standards given at the tenth grade level. You have put Massachusetts Ian is. In the reader if you will against other international schools my recollection is that you agreed to have out some of us students at least tested. Against the international peers. Tell us what's going on what -- and when we might see the results Massachusetts kids go an up against those kids from other countries."

" That's correct it's called it -- testing and it's math and science and stashed around the world we. Along -- Minnesota have signed up as if we're -- nation if you well we're going to be compared -- only get the United States as they do random sampling units say. We're going to get a specific school from Massachusetts as well Minnesota shall see exactly where we stand and I predict. That there will be a few countries that go by some aqua saying that we're actually losing ground in my opinion. Because it's not just the Singapore's in this world that beating some and its -- the Italy and Ireland and Australia Finland. Except for so but I think it's important for us to know that and that's why we've agreed to be proud of the fact Christian Andersen and future of the board was. Being present high tech council as you well known high tech communities very concerned about competitiveness and he pushed on having XP products."

" And what is at grade level MC in Florida -- candidates lost in eighth it will case will we witness or -- gets in the fallout from all the help. It takes awhile to get those results are pretty sure get them."

" David you mentioned the old days you know kids had to go a break from school to work on the -- tell us your thoughts on a longer school days. And a longer school year benefits costs how do you look at it as a professional educator on the --"

" Well I think we -- do we need to look at it from the point of view of the child and and many many children every. Little children need a lot more time school particularly in older urban areas I mean the issue having kids leave school in June come back in September the regression. Or inner city kids who don't have stimulation reading museums would have a is significant so put some kids particularly those of about nine they need more time on task the kids in the suburbs some camps and they may not so it's not something that's necessarily universal. But looking at it individually for the -- a law tadic it's just like about the fact that we dumped millions of kids in Detroit Oakland whatever 230 in the afternoon without supervision it's -- So we need to robust afterschool programs we need summer programs so we need a longer school day longer school year. -- kids it is costly I don't think it has to be an extension of the school day. In I mean the school the other having teachers to it at that kind of costs there's a lot of community based organizations a lot of activities. Very stimulating the kids that I think will will will help it's been a matter of having to take take that bureaucracy of schools system and spend all that money if you will. You know getting 25% more of the billions that was spending now I think there economical ways to -- but it's crucial that some kids."

" It's -- you know you've hit where I've heard people reference a status with governor Deval Patrick most recently -- you've been on the issue. And yet of course took that cost is is is incredible and you look at the struggled a lot of communities and I having with regard to overrides. Based upon existing operating costs and capital capital needs in the like this is not an easy issue to to solve."

" Now it's not you know -- reality has -- a great effort very successful program content communities so the beach warning. But he at least write us telling legislature's going to cost 13 hundred dolls student that's a lot of money when he steps to in the number of kids who really needed Seoul if it is it is costly and and I would agree with the -- cycle around the state. I'm not sure I've seen some of the financial crises that would seeing in most places the storms and saw it uses in -- as the others we're seeing some very very serious cutbacks in local communities most of regional because of health. Insurance so that the cost of special education the cost -- just outstripping what they're able to raise through -- of the property to actually stated so it's becoming crisis."

" Let me -- shift key is if I can't David we're talking a commissioner David Driscoll is the commissioner of education has been on the scene in in the front lines from many many years. Soon to go off to a well learned retirement China's schools always controversial -- what are your thoughts what have you seen in the China school experience. That either holds a warning before -- boy suggests that this promise Cia."

" Well first of all you're absolutely right about the current is that he tells me in as many people about neutral and that maybe the fact that they funded by having the money go to the district and then go follow the child so it's for the district it's simply the -- camera pocket. So on the one hand the district says you know -- not -- kind of money by having those kids and yet it's costing us. In the just schools of course as saying -- money ought to follow the child and so -- it for so I think it's a proper pot of education reform. It's something that's initiative that's that's gone across the country theory being everybody as a serious to -- schools don't work and one of them. Is that the union rules in the bureaucracy -- both state and local it inhibits good education today people could just before read from that and and and just focus on what they want to focus on -- and particularly kids' education good things happen. As you must expect I think that -- schools it's a -- story -- some wonderful wonderful. Success stories in the suburb of Boston effective 32 schools suggest -- nationals. Recognition and there are -- Boston but we've had a pleasant and and two -- in Boston actually three of -- close I've recommended to close so. There an experiment. What I'd seen with a good once some tremendous first of all they have a longer school dental school secondly they have a lot more parental involvement. They almost like parochial schools -- require parents to take a more active role that very clear on the rules so that parents are required to commences -- the -- that they haven't addressed -- reform something to pilot's uniform parent has to commit and so forth so. Thanks so it's seems to me the good ones all have this time they spend on developing. Character requirements and sometimes accused make up -- world. The rules for little list of what do with the going to do around honesty in respecting one another working shall so. So the things I -- I think there have been more success stories in serious but like any experiments is going to be did in the that."

" Mixed -- been talking to commissioner David Driscoll is going to be kind enough to stay with with us for some calls your calls on. And cast -- you name it. Overrides in the like Dave Driscoll is the most knowledgeable guy in Massachusetts in my opinion on education."

" Welcome back this is Tom Finneran we have on the line commissioner of education David Driscoll David you noticed that break. Begins and ends with the Boston Red Sox. What as it should passage. What helped what else is no -- it's Boston it's about time the nation has a fever David you've been great to give us so much time indicated he would be he would like to take some calls 6172666868 is the number here email address is T Finneran -- WR KO dot com again we have an -- the commissioner of education David Driscoll he's given us his thoughts his experience on dropout rate him as China schools a whole host of things interested in New York concern -- experiences -- what's good what's bad. What should week David Driscoll knee and the rest of the audience know EB -- he -- town what's going on that impression you are infuriate you let's go right to Bobby at Dartmouth Bobby annexed confederates forum with commissioner of education David Driscoll."

" I found another reluctant fan of the show thank you -- just stood effective played out that the best private schools which orders we hear about a longer here. And I don't understand why you'd think that more of the same -- underperforming schools will help I think. Problems are not going to be so by a longer school day and of course a couple of more money. And it in my opinion one issue you gotta look at it. Two families two parents are working in most families tax -- takes so much out of your income that it's necessary. It really takes involve parents at home I think that's the problem."

" Well I think that's exactly right and that's the advantage of the schools have a means you know has some kids for its -- at home schools just make sure they provide the basics and get out of the -- I agree with views that the kind of camera support doesn't work Terrell -- school day was school time actually learning. However for those kids don't have those damages that those kids to private schools have. They need more time I would agree with -- it's not just about a longer school day and year in the sense of aboard the longer than we we need. Engaging activities some of those activities I don't think necessarily need to be provided by the school system -- the community based organizations museums boys and girls clubs other things can provide activities but I think we need to separate out. Kids who go to private schools would have all the advantages including support that moment to parents. And those to the struggling schools that basically need time. So to have a kid leave school in -- and not -- controls September you need to start toward urban teachers to understand how much those -- have progressed. I think we have to separate -- We talked about -- longer school day at school -- that's license not for everybody those that have support school most of them."

" You know did the gentleman it's called makes an excellent point about what. The situation is what's the environment that -- I cannot help but be reminded of the story from the Deval Patrick campaign trail. Where he had the good fortune to go way to Milton academy came back after a break. Somebody and his family of one of his Davis is somebody said GP to talk and white you sound white as if there's all a white are black way to speak. You -- white in his grandmother said no he sounds. Educated he sounds educated that was a grandmother. Obviously who understood the need to provide an atmosphere at home that would support what in this case -- future governor was experiencing. At at an open academy and you know alcohol is huge China."

" There's always says that's great story him and he usually you know from the district that you represent. And -- the role you had statewide what do disparity there is society mean you know that's been and I don't blame the caller right. It's a very good point about and Milton academy in Nutley -- longer school day. But I think what people -- missing is the tremendous disparity between kids who have. Advantages of a support at home in the suburbs in summer camps and using encryption whatever and polish kids that you represent. Who really don't have any stimulating activities be on the school. Which we have kids who have a school breakfasts and school like. That's school lunch maybe the last merely have to open next -- so I think it's it's that it will when we look at it from state level it's still real disparity. -- and I ended at 140 ones schools. That are that the 500 Ochoa -- are in nine cities in messages. So you know we we really -- the idea that we need direct."

" Let's take some all calls were talking with commissioner David Driscoll in Iran generous forum the numbers 6172666868 we're going to go right to Paul ending a blog you why next on parents forum AM 680 WR KO."

" Good morning. I can't I just wanted to -- the commissioner well at this status is allowed by kitty. -- it some more education on the curriculum or Bob worrying about our audience financials and I think that nature."

" I think that's a very good point we have kids even some of diabetic kids and as a brighter kids who -- politely schools. Again at college they democratic sides sent to them -- that works and before you know what that broke it completely broken up by christmas break because they don't understand interest. So this issue of the practicality of financial literacy in many other practical courses or practical knowledge. Is something we we pay attention to and and I think one of the things public education pastor recognized for more than a decade. Kids have -- about service across America and then number one complained about high school. Is that it's boring and they see no connection between what they learned what you're going to need some of the column makes a good point we need financial literacy programs and other very practical programs on the kids. Understand the realities of life it is that's happening -- that your experience is fact the -- Mercury is division actually runs as a curricula national curriculum. And we combined with them both of them from the administration about the Patrick administration. There -- various high schools and they have all curriculum around interest and compound interest in different ways of banking and courses and mortgages -- etc. And the -- it because it's it's as they say practical they can get it. Their teeth into it and they can see -- effects could affect penalizes states as they try to to develop long truck or whatever it might be so these kinds of things I think -- very important relating. The academics to real life situations in many cases can be very effective."

" We're talking to the commissioner of education David Driscoll a number here is 6172666868 we're interested in your cause your experience your frustrations with education and -- David you'd mentioned. That about 98 of the 121 schools identified as failing fallen to nine cities off the top of the -- those cities would be clearly. For a vote -- in Boston spring it was wolf. All right Ann are there any school systems David that in your experience. With whatever the -- economic and family demographic -- disadvantages. Any data outperforming -- college. Punching above you wait so you know let's say -- a 160 pound the prize throw a punch like a 230 -- who's really hit the ball solidly the F for the kids notwithstanding disadvantages."

" The night was -- I think there are schools in all of those districts I just mentioned certainly Boston won the national broke toward the company's. Tremendous and work -- more finalists for -- isn't wrong. So there are schools in in all of those communities -- mentioned that that if you look at these numbers and particularly -- mobility rate they clearly the fighting about it late. And so so -- those pockets and in fact I think sometimes the urban schools judged purely because so there -- some schools and only -- 40% mobility to meaning. That -- say that the 40% of the kids they haven't given day they're not going to have by the end of the year. So so -- out about 15% in most of these urban their respective globes very in depth story about amcats and only looked at those kids whose status of the ninth grade and at the 12 grade and Boston. And Boston was that the state average in terms passing and Castro he chose to challenge so sometimes the raw numbers. To a distrust in justice to the urban areas many of them you know golf America east William dalmatians school you know the ones in Boston have won national claim they really do an outstanding job given the challenge."

" A punch above their weight 6172666868 is the number to call we have the commissioner of education David Driscoll let's go right to grace. Grace is a teaching here in Boston grace welcomed the generous form what commissioner Driscoll."

" I can morning that's what I expect -- to protect -- boat and charter schools as well as regular all. And when you talk about the disparity that exists between charter schools are regulars all its huge debate when you talk about that's like popular. Charter schools and I expect did not keep the event. I'm very. And perhaps special needs it's like revolving door they try to target all summer -- to I would want to -- most are not. So my real concern -- why don't we erupt. Schools and -- I think that's the real answer break them down -- the pilot program which has been wiped at fault for that particular population."

" Well you raise a good point and I think statistically that that's why the jury's always -- China's schools for every statistic that seems to show that they do while those seemed to say that they have a special population so interesting -- from me. Out of school advocates in -- school opponents Carol. These statistics and they are using my statistics these -- same numbers to prove whatever point to polls that I I think that -- makes. An interesting point and that is that. Out of schools first of all the difference which out of school is that some ago. Made some pro active steps to get that child to that school about my grandmother girl would have her -- But somebody did something so and and and they don't if they have too many applicants which many of them do most of them have waiting list. They do have a lottery system we tracked very carefully to the college point one and nation kids back or when kids leave the child schools go back to school some of the job schools had a history too many kids in my judgment many of them specialist being sent back to the public schools -- one reason enough. But -- we look at that we look for improvement and in most cases they make adjustments overtime and then not to. But I would say on general they don't have the same percentage of viva bilingual kids or that is you know kids or special -- kids as to the regular. Public schools."

" Let's go right to John in Dedham Johnny enacts with commissioner Driscoll and Tom Finneran on children's forum."

" Public schools in the -- but -- which cheated out of -- and now I have. You're so that's currently -- me. -- Jews from Eric receipt if rates have been dismissed it. Which means it was stopped them on the you know. And like at my site its great rate now three years like wasted the -- it. What was once we get into the school. -- at my son -- an old school and don't say well in joint. Special needs to. You know just look at what direction make -- my -- still is gradually --"

" Well I don't know all the -- just a -- they they might not be coming back simply because whale actual level but. Assuming you are right that it is something wrong they would actually dismissed. That's one of the real tragedies schools systems we have to do a better job of evaluating. Cages and making sure there's nothing better in society that wonderful teacher thankfully we have thousands of across Congo. But there are some now and they ought not to be teaching how to find another Korea so there are studies nationally this show if a student of the child gets a couple of been effective teachers in the world can make a big difference so I would advocates -- So it would school I don't know they're going to middle school now have different finishing fifth grade. But I would advocate just sit with the with the administration and they staff six grade seven. And and and be very pro active because it may be that -- is behind -- unfortunately parents have to be. Very vigilant -- and if you had that kind of unfortunate situation the school system does have to step up here. And do something it's seems to me if the child on."

" Let's go right to Ralph in no Ralph you're next on generous farm with commissioner of education David Driscoll and Tom Finneran."

" Morning guys the commission addressed -- question I'd like to know where where the department of education -- the issue of these odd person superintendent of schools sensitive isn't sure yet he was an entity -- new since the Soviet ever Forester. I don't sure you know that he was invited and we being to sufficient facts were on role here four excepting. Air conditioners that were paid for by a public on -- it was house. There's controversy ought beyond that in this inspector general's office sent letters that we chairman of the school war permits are. Ethics commission has struck a superintendent using a school personnel to do -- else. Can you comment on that was."

" I have to be careful about comedy because obviously in this business legal ramifications but let me just say history we watched that which we monitor that situation we wanted to many of the situations role. Isn't necessarily the employment superintendent -- But more than a license and so if there is something that that filed -- guilty except for a we can infect takeaways likes and so while I can say is that we monitor the case. We we followed the case in the specific cities that you mentioned. In fact is now another round I guess doesn't involve schools system involves. Actually the government over the weekend something in the paper -- inspector general FB IB and that's -- so. Who -- if there's anything that's definitive that we we act."

" Appreciate the call -- to a commission to stress that you have been fabulous I have the two a couple of little things here first. Thank you for joining us given so much time taking calls as well as offering your insights to congratulate you want to fabulous fabulous Korea as -- said a couple of times already a huge pair of shoes. Now have to be filled and it's going to be very very difficult to fill them. As impressively as you have and I guess last but not least regrets on behalf of I'll say it I'll be bold enough to speak for around the listening audience here in pro logic community. Regrets that we're not going to have a person of the our integrity your intelligence acting is to stew would fall off public education here in the commonwealth of Massachusetts we're going to miss you David Driscoll thanks for being with us today on veterans for a."

" Thank you very much -- factual and works all the best --"