A woman's testimony sends two men to jail for a crime they didn't commit

I had morning Boston this season -- CD WRKO. Huge you may remember air. This story about Robin Murphy we talked about it many times and how it relates to state auditor Suzanne Bump. Now where he was -- gave a cult. That operated in Fall River that call themselves Satan -- vendors. And Robin Murphy. Claim that she was present when three women were killed as part of this double worshiping cult some ritualistic slaying. Now she pleaded guilty. In connection on one of the three homicides because she needed deal with a -- DA Ronald peanut. Now questions have been raised about that deal in the decade sends those crimes. But you know is that broadening her feet testified. Against two men and sent those men to jail for life. One of them. Is a guy named Carl -- her other victim died imprisoned behind bars he was mentally -- had a lot of problems. His intelligence was a little below average she sent this -- Jill but the help of DA had his hand come under a lot of questions if you will Ronald Pina. So why merit member of Robin Murphy -- may or call. Because. He campaigned. Since the end bop. Who was a formal labor secretary was appointed by Deval Patrick. Hit me pretty controversial hire. Rob Murphy whose own mother described her as cool cool. She'd drew -- is loaded double when she was a little girls used to screen Howell like a Fisher cat into the night her own mother would tell investigators much later. Ron -- you had a long history of drug abuse. And in scenes sort of rankings. Mean did you send these two guys to -- polite now might you know this is my show -- -- irregularity or -- or has read my books. Read my comment Harold I am not someone. Who wants to spring people from prison -- Fought long and hard to get Melissa's law passed successfully because I truly believe -- So of the three day the -- he enemies say this guy needs to get help. Look through -- and imprisoned at 32 years based on the word of Robin Murphy Pratt and Murphy. Spent 22 years behind bars. Two years behind bars because she said yes I killed -- Mars to. She initially told investigators she was at the murders of two other women Doreen the Baskin Barbara and -- Proposed. When she was released from jail. She was tired. So she gets parole in 2004. -- she gets tired -- Suzanne Bump to become. Division of unemployment employee if you can believe that's in you laid up copper a firefighter. Back in 0506. How sad and you have does -- Robin Murphy via check this convicted killer this admitted seeing more chipper. Got a job honesty payroll people are actually flabbergasted and that's why so many people who knew this Robin Murphy story was stunned. Stunning. When Suzanne Bump one. Well somebody you may not have kept up with what happened next. Robin Murphy got locked up again. Last summer. Shockingly enough I mean how what a shocker she gets locked up again the state fires her from her job she's still at Framingham state prison. But she had yet another hearing in front of the parole board of course now this is a brand new recently revamped Parole Board. -- you some of Robin Murphy statement at this Parole Board. Because I lied about it. I think correct you about that. On the record. First degree murder. We finally can cost of the story. Hello how she was killed when we got -- started again they -- like chocolate -- be a candidate in the fact that view. Could put forth. -- your story and then we can't give my regret and -- we're a little find out what really happened so the real. -- in world -- What is the -- that I. Don't think you do. You don't because rob Murphy is lies sent an innocent man to jail. Part of the -- ever ever ever heard me describe any kind victory in -- as innocent. Our -- -- and I've investigated this case myself thoroughly Carl drew is innocent is not a single shred of evidence that ties him. Two of these homicides. And that is why his attorney. Whose name is Michael Cutler who has long believing Carl -- innocence is now asking. For -- -- sentenced to be. Pardons it's called the commutation and Michael Cutler we appreciate you taking the time this morning to explain for us what happens next in this case. After yet another shocking presentation from Robin Murphy. Michael Tyler welcome. Thank you Michelle for heavily dependent on behalf of -- -- thank you so much for your interest in this case it's it's just absolutely critical. To keep our focus on this and to enable. Neither neither position to begin the process of seeking -- a commutation when -- Like do you -- all about the leak it would be involved in the procedure. And then we can talk about about Karl Case a little time you have available until they got handled. I -- perfect day so Rollins Michael Cutler he is representing Carl truly represented him when he when he appealed the sentence of the some reason SJ CU luster release Cognex. Wouldn't give -- drew on the trial. Well I'm not gonna. Comment on the adjacent track record and on occasion but I know I will say that I would be very disappointed in the courts should treatment in this case. We'll talk over about the commutation power process first of all afterwards. Prisoner is sentenced in the court so give the appellate review into the case. -- it is possible for the governor. To get involved in need to grant the pardon which exonerates the prisoner or -- commutations which shorten the sentence. In these types of cases which is just say -- Polls the practice when there was a product -- should I can talk all about that's true is ordinarily not to make it. Prisoner immediately parole eligible but the communications just trying server close to eighteen months that means that the prisoner he immediately eligible or being put in the pre release its. And the practical then deeper -- to be moved by the Christian department. Into a pre released this truly so we can begin to experience that -- we do security ensure that we can have a public safety and put. Change to review his progress in -- sport for the Parole Board would then later once you reach is called ability. Change there in purple release so that's sort of what's involved in the process. Okay wait -- let's just talk about his case for a minute because people are alleged -- to -- in the procedure as they are and whether or not. Carl drew is a guy who has spent more than three decades in prison. Based on the word -- an admitted liar. Who essentially testify in front of the parole boy I have to admit the parole board's reaction with completely appropriate I mean I. To sit there were astonished I think is an understatement to say that they maligned her. The these lies that sent people to jail polite well one man died one minute and 32 years there. I think the Parole Board reacted appropriately -- America remains in jail but the bottom line is Michael brother do you believe your client is innocent of these charges. Completely buy you one thing to understand about Robin Murphy usually witnessed by the prosecution in this case will not only the bailout were simply to second degree murder. In this case they gave her immunity. For murdering two other people. It the other thing to understand about heard having put so much else you publicize called group -- who was indicted for his second place after she reached into her testimony which you get by the way the court trial of this change we can't do. Or -- -- accusation the second charge was ballpark against -- through. And indicate to Carlton was convicted he also had a code differences. That -- and that's when -- words parents teachers and all indicting him well and that. Second. Chris you're a man -- -- -- Carl Davis who was indicted for as a co defendant in the murder of the -- traditional. The prosecutor also no cost. -- -- We had a key news that Robin Murphy was a bold faced a liar with a lot of mental and drug issues so it's it's truly. I I think it's astonishing Michael Cutler and I think you'll agree when you really look at this case and I have and I know you have the idea that. Body was sent to prison based on the word of this lunatic. Is truly extraordinary. Well apart from apart from the fact that at this point in time mission all. Every single alleged eyewitness to this case and we can't live headset in fact so what I said that the trial was a wide. And it and they called -- but I never sort of who commit the murder -- -- -- or convicted of our our combat. The prosecution's own power line for you this case it is it's completely impossible. So that didn't move that content rich. A reputable. Witnesses say they last saw Robin Murphy of the victims together. And the time that Robin Murphy wasn't actually buying a witness to a portion was intimidated into taking the Fifth Amendment can it was striking that she would be prosecuted. -- a trial if she. Have to -- for the defense. That that felt like I won't -- everything in this case. Much and happened within -- -- that you are trying to trade him yet. By Robin -- testimony. Their -- about a 46 dollar on principles allegedly happened worked with people cruising around downtown Fall River driving out towards the west court I mean this Warren -- ritual event. Burning the body into burning the body -- its freshman -- did you get. Why did -- the way there was never card which is -- of the fact that the detective who also believes and Carl throughs and it's and he'll be joining us in just a few minutes font carry. Well Bob -- said at the very least if you would give the woman immunity connection with two murders she admitted to committing -- you have to tell get the park to tell you the body is. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Without all carries intrepid work on this case Paula initially did -- -- -- who believe the cauldron was guilty. End up being investigating this case from that perspective running with Robin -- story. But it was his investigation. That led him -- for the trial that. Carl was completely innocent. He was then it's taken off the -- even though he would. He over it is part of the telephone conversation where pretrial Robin Murphy admitted it the whole thing have been made up. All -- diligence in this case has been absolutely phenomenal and I actually going to be shoulder sore this case and some are. Very much your product in georgians and then I'm gonna work. We encourage announced people who have never heard the story before wrote Michael Cutler who has represented Carl Lewis and why would this woman with motive to put into guys in jail for our current -- commit. And what what would be the motive of the and I think -- Paula carrying nano that when he said this is a very high profile case it happened in -- in Fall River of course famous -- -- Lizzie Borden in her forty whacks. This case -- was garnering national headlines you know cult murders I needed that. And when these arrests took place of Karlsruhe and Carl Davis. Day in the words of Paul Carey he said Ronald. All of I can then literally -- prevalent and among the prosecutor I I. Who will say that at a better about this some over a period of a couple of years. There were a number of what I think or characterize as you try prosecute murders in the Bristol county area I think they're about eight or nine out of young women can. We're proud all. Killed at -- in at this period is totally. And I related slayings that remain unsolved by the way. That's correct I think there was some believe that they might have had the actual culprits in the end the Carl. Unfortunately these killings continue adapter or the prosecution all these people. -- -- Suggest that Karl drew and Carl Davis didn't pull off those homicides. That fit a pattern if they continued after these two guys were falsely imprisoned. I played pipes and I understand that that's my entrance as well. Okay now so the next step for you and Michael Cutler is his attorney I didn't understand the process of asking for a pardon. I thought this involved do you is a little lawyer. Having a conversation with Deval Patrick or perhaps some executives and CEO's executive office of public safety but no the way it works is that you have to petition the Parole Board. First and I spoke I spoke with a probe what spokeswoman this morning via email. She said that there is still has not been a decision rendered in the Robin Murphy case but what they have to consider first is your request for a commutation to how -- that work. I'll be glad to explain that I should both cases save and in the process of pulling that together -- -- yet actually filed something but I am working on it but I do expect to have something in within the next month or true. I went in the process that involves two three particular three separate. Decision making body -- The first is these states all forward. The second that the governor. And the third as the governor's executive council the governor's executive council's primary role means is giving some advice and consent of governor appointments -- -- judicial appointments they also its final form Parole Board appointments. As well. If they vote on commutations. When a commutation request just -- I was actually filed with the executive -- -- if council refers to -- filing. -- deep hole for. The pork board that -- recommendation either favorable or unfavorable. Recommendation goes through the governor. -- governor's dog found by the parole board's recommendation by it is rare that a governor would. Overrule the -- for truck. -- much less time somebody in Massachusetts was pardoned because we're up against a break Michael -- the last time someone in the state actually received a pardon our commutation. It's been more than twenty years to go -- that -- the magazine story on this last year to talk about how no governor has been engaged in this process this process. It's something bodily harm and rehabilitation but actually reached two restriction could scrub all Christian people had always at risk because it. If British have no hope. I've been that -- creates a frustration that good what that that was not deter violence you can understand that don't own situation. Well believe me Michael Allen Allen gonna accuse me of being a bleeding heart when it comes to context that this case is disturbed me. From the Mets had an opening those boxes that are other Fall River justice center because. There is is there are shredded I'll ask Leo is there why shred a forensic science the ties are trying to these homicides. Not -- rivers and not why shredding and we had the governor writing letters on behalf have been the Blair who is who was tight to the crimes he stands accused of via DNA -- drew there is nothing that puts him at the scene of these murders other than the testimony of Robin Murphy and people that she intimidated and frightened. And -- all day it is in every one of them have recanted so I think that if there was ever clear. Case. Justice needing to be served this is certainly the only one I can figure out. I appreciate your Michelle. While Michael -- please keep us up to date on what happens next the good news is -- you know we don't have to sit around and wondered does crime pay because at least Robert -- is not getting paid by the state taxpayer a war. Too painful or her another way is she -- EU master's degree behind bars. And now she's back in and CI Framingham I'm sure that maybe she's gonna get a doctorate on the taxpayer now. All believe that usual Michael Cutler thank you very much for European diligence -- -- please -- keep -- -- today -- that are very. I nice letter from Karlsruhe. That I'll share with the out listeners on my FaceBook page at some point today but you know I'm I'm I really do hope this is successful thing Hammond and I'm sure he appreciate your work. Michelle thank you so much for your interest and your diligence on this thank you again. Okay Michael Tyler he is the attorney who is going to asset Carl drew be released from prison and he should be released. This -- you her her own statements -- in front of Parole Board this march. -- -- Need -- -- can cockpit Lott like about these two guys because she had. A personal beef with them and her vendetta led these men. And to prison where one would die in one remains there 32 years later and well see a problem with that. 6172666860. Day. Public high and ABC with that Harding he asked if she died anyone a job let her help and she said though. While that's according to -- straws and at Harding an email on that club more -- he was a great guy. I'm Michelle -- we are AM 680 WRKO 6172666860. EAY combat detective Paul Carey. Will be joining us with his stick. Welcome back I think this is a resounding theme we are AM -- -- New York have. -- -- -- -- -- is -- convicted killer named Robin Murphy. Whose own mother said she was so previous -- girls used to -- little pictures of the gavel. Detective Paul Carey who worked this case the years -- -- -- -- to be obsessed with -- along into is retired head. -- is now he is supposed to be kicking back up the mean and joy in life detective -- carried the EU continue. To be obsessed with this Fall River satanic cult murders case welcome to the Michelle McPhee show. -- -- -- Now now detective carried -- what is things 88 utility and -- deal was. About how you had interviewed Robin Murphy's mom and she talked about even as a little girl. There was something seriously wrong she was doodling pictures of the doubles. What we found 111 a full house who spoke with them and we found buildings that will affect who we should probably. -- Korea's oldest member. The pictures of I developed. So were -- -- So US and he was eleven years old obsessed with seeing which would be fifteen. That follows her throughout her life you know there was that there was a barrel of Satan that you discovered over her lover's bed. In Fall River. Your group who are -- or. Now it that -- and the reason you are interested in this case and and I think one of the things you've said to me before detected as luck. It is. -- drew a pillar of the community note I wanna have a BO with a guy nobody can I think he'd heard these women absolutely not. So tell us why you so steadfast in thinking that Carlton was an innocent man. Well I look like basement -- -- with the commander for most of his rupiah. -- put the -- in the major crime division that was my crew that. More the case in. And when the first minister took place I believe that was the I'm looking through high school. And I -- -- -- and then the movies people don't call me because they've done a previous previous to this of that. Few of the people that were involved in this in this cult stuff as well. There are so right there have been people of the PlayStation them couldn't come through Harlem. And evidently -- on a car at this particular. A problem and in this in this event. With a prostitute. Well and -- thought comment for this statement. As it did you have many people have a lot of the same level of confidence they have. I am formally invite you to you don't have to look at and the only thing -- I think look -- pick you know expand the Israeli -- here on the there's a man. I think if you own and I feel I gonna -- my in my pocket and -- -- -- If -- is most of them. -- the real nadir of an ordinary -- so now and I'm not a stranded there hair routes eighteen and you can voluntarily. Take a DNA sample they certainly don't offer up hey you know you can take pitches and I -- to lose you can. You think it would -- need to do. And don't use very cooperative better chances cooperation that allegedly these guys and does not -- -- already have edited steadily winning some there is that harder. So much there's so much more -- was does that mean. -- of these funny people -- him that. This post most obliging him a visual of overrun and so that I mean if he did it remembers when Lehman veteran talent because they -- -- up. He wasn't married or anything though they would have been long gone appear as though all of that but metric that by the evidence. But control my investigation with Robin Murphy in that. And on that I'm a -- midfield with -- the whole thing him. And that's an impetus -- -- that you know from previous experiences because talked to them and they do whatever they want -- -- is that. Which is that the prideco Barbara poles and trees that remove the state police who. He was quote. Fact of Britain's it was. Not caucus method that is not of sound mind even men who could -- that haven't northern -- on this bill. So you let them know that they've played -- so. And then or federal -- could move those going to affect -- met pursuant to the state police and says that I'm harassing room. So in the November proposal that was committed that you could be a witness against -- -- says who -- -- or at the time. -- so the whole case and pot carries her is very complicated. I don't know where there are all these different people all these different presentations but the bottom line is what happened right now if we if we go to. March 22 well. Robin Murphy once again is in -- the Parole Board this is what she told the Parole Board and it's not something that you -- surprised by. But the -- old boy it certainly was considering that this woman then landed a job on the state payroll after she was paroled the first time in 2004. I lied about. I think correct you about now. -- on the record. It's we finally concocted a story. How she was killed when we got -- started again -- -- right now where we're headed in the happy that you could put forth. But your story and then we can't get my regret involved. Okay. You know we're a little find out what really happened so the real. Story won't really matter I'm. Natali del. What is the -- and I. Don't. -- And that's the thing nobody knows who the real truth the only thing that's for certain -- -- -- is that you truly believe. They're Karl who's innocent his attorney believes that he is innocent. And I am hardly a bleeding heart for the convict I think anyone elicits of the show know that even I think -- drew is innocent and what did she have. And the reason it was so easy to check Carl do up to take the fall for these birds is the big guy literally. Could not read or write he did have a single soul in the state of Massachusetts that -- called family. He know anyone couldn't read or write he had no money he was dead broke and you are railroaded right into prison that act an accurate assessment detective. That's quite accurately so that's quite accurate. So he was the perfect candidate for this case. Obama probably method Campbell who everybody I mean in that was in the bimbo who may AMA about. -- usually. Preventable all the system and see if you know it's -- -- it's appalling the whole thing is and then Robin guess for -- what the state -- that's of completely ridiculous. I mean if you had any crime does stayed positive the whole thing it's that. Our whole thing -- just the perfect song for -- there's a person could be. What. And needing to climb like that and found guilty and so -- two years in -- I'm assuming he he doesn't belong there you know. I have this thing as a good guy apparently there's got to be a victim bloody reminder. If you can get out that covered phase it looks so that the -- may never see him again. That a friend of mine's but he didn't commit commitment film as a bottom line. And I and I believe it because I have gone through those files and you know those boxes and boxes and evidence on this case and the only thing that -- -- drew. Two of these homicides that all is Robin Murphy was a lunatic. Now you tell me semi of fellow detectives were afraid of her because she just looks so scary and he talked about how she how old putting a like a Fisher cat. You know well rounded up the phone away from me and -- Sacramento balance so we feel as if there and -- he even says that who up. Some in the newspaper. That'd be incorporated is there any of that whole cool. He's never afraid saw me. And in the my favorite quote from you I think detective was that. They -- -- -- is not the type a woman that you wanna see you window at night. I don't know how tough are not afraid of a relative who wanted to clear they have had I'd be very concerned what is that -- it. He's quite concerned that crept up -- but. I lot of while detective -- -- thank you to take the time to join us this morning you know we gonna continue to follow this case until there is some real justice system real answers. Primarily from the old prosecutor Ronald Pina who I think suffered a stroke and and is in hiding somewhere. And we gonna demands Manson's from the governor on this and -- are gonna make sure the right thing happens for Carl Russo detected you rock thank you for coming on the show. Nominee John McPhee do you think Carl Rowe should get six went 72666868. I have to tell you what I prison sources. I told -- Robin Murphy. Guard -- Boston University master's degree in theater arts and -- And you know. Wait until you hear the list of freebies that are offered to inmates that's that of someone. Emailed to me from a -- it is Howell areas it's coming up on Michelle McPhee and we are WRK. Boy -- come back plaza mrs. Michelle McKee we are -- fixated WRK OI try to find the on the record episode. This is -- up. And Ed -- had an have a lot of time to do -- but I can tell you this. And much. When Robin Murphy the convicted Satan worshipping Keller went in front of the -- board she had a couple low witnesses testify on her behalf. And one of them. Was Suzanne -- husband. Who talked about how we had lunch with a convicted killer quite often. When she was working for the state. He talked about how we would go to the building and meter an avalanche of their all the time so -- is am I don't want to claims she had nothing to do a drug emerging getting tired that is a bold. Faced lie. And I have video. Of her husband giving testimony as a matter of fact I'll bring a video into Ed tomorrow we can hear from Susie and bombs. Husband. More from the Parole Board hearing had because I want people to hear it. And and we are going to in the in the meantime. Well this is Robin Murphy repeating the statement this segment to deal polite this woman -- collecting. I speak taxpayer funded paycheck and working toward. A state taxpayer funded pension it is astonishing. And -- this Parole Board hearing goes on for hours and I have the video and it took me hours and hours to transcribe it. But he -- all Boyd was. Paula let me get this straight Houston two guys to jail for life losing carefully. I lied about. Correct you about that. It's we finally can cost of the story. Love how she was killed and we'll decide exactly how I don't know where we'll be a candidate in the happy that you could put forth. But your story and then we can't get my regret when. So we. Know we're a little -- -- what really happened so the real. Story you know really it's. Totally. What is the truth and I. Don't think. I don't think yeah I don't think you ever well -- you. Didn't have a too bad behind bars. Speaker is in his Parole Board hearing. She testified about how she got to Boston University. Master's degree in theater arts courtesy of the messages -- there and BO. -- she gets this free master's degree in theater are the ball thing and in how to come out because she said to the probe Boyd I'm just a play. I'm just a plan. And the public like yeah that's the problem -- Lara play out. And she's an I I isn't the player it adds it to. Stage. Actress because I have this Boston University theater degree astonishing. So why NASA presents us minded to could be youth theatre school. Any go nuts at all -- -- a very funny list as you wish list is pretty comical I think so. Let's see even recreational. Freebies to inmates. Art programs. Art therapy color graffiti. That chess club. Fitness program the green house -- -- garden program. Of course have a basketball program I'm music program I newsletter journalism program. A poetry group -- by a Boston University professor every month artist from the community meet with inmates to reviewing critique damp palms. Can you imagine this. Every month artists from the community meet the -- reviewing critique their palms a weekly scrabble. Group. Religious programs include Bible study Christian action fellowship program Christian book review Church of God -- services. Church of latter day saints. Deep in simple group. Deep in simple group is -- discussion oriented program that is intended to help inmates come to terms of long time incarceration. Emotional awareness and healing. To Foster emotional and spiritual growth. Foleo -- program. Growing together. Needed American spiritual circle to -- mobile witness program. Prison fellowship going for the gold Spanish Bible study Spanish warships services teaching Christian values teach children. Victory spiritual warfare program. I mean twist goes. And. And about it. All of the different ways in which prisoners in the state of Massachusetts are Connell. So when Murphy got -- Boston University theater arts degree. Courtesy of the Massachusetts taxpayer that is released from prison in 2004. In gets a taxpayer funded job. Courtesy of -- -- who's now the state auditor who apparently is denying her role in hiring Susie and Bob. And I denial. Would be alive folks because her husband was one of the people -- march just a few months ago who testified. When Robin Murphy spent half. So steamy is -- absolutely extraordinary. There's an innocent man behind bars the perpetrators of that injustice. -- on the state payroll. She's committing more crimes allegedly gets locked up and says yeah I don't have the whole story. I made up the whole story this guy is still in jail. Let the craziest thing you've ever heard Helen. You are next time -- I'm -- you know I. Is there a book on net interest right in there it goes. But there is not a book on -- yet but there will be soon -- on the shore because I am just I didn't actually astonished the warrant read about this -- -- the case -- -- go through. They had done more interviews or conduct with Carl drew in the people around them it's just really. -- -- injustice there when you see it's an. And to consider the fact that there are people in the state who laid off from the registry from fire departments from police department admitted to go talk to this convicted killer to get their check is not let. Really only Massachusetts -- Yes only in Massachusetts they -- the way I'm reading a book about and what else. While they do I you glad speaking of Amazon that book is called Carla talent -- glad to -- guys appeal request. Why didn't I do yeah today I mean really -- A man who pumped that if people forget. This guy was like a sexual weirdo a deviancy was putting picked up his junk. All of the I did that and he was he told his wife that he was a British spy in quite wealthy and the fact Monday was. Dead broke and when all of this started to unravel this why he pumped a bullet into his baby daughter's deluge was so cute Lillian rose only. I men outside his wife to death it was awful and -- and this can this guy and people might just heard it. -- SEC just ruled that his conviction would be upheld because the cops -- every right to go into the house to look for the dead bodies. All I know I know what. I'm just really really injury did the book tried to I can't put it down. Well thank you -- that the very nice endorsement I appreciate that very much. Are they when it's handwritten I'll send you the first copy armed hey thank you thank you. Thank you how tied for the call and I mean you -- all these homicides in Massachusetts and you think about that the money the money that is spent nearly a muscle his lawyer. During his trial costs the taxpayer two million and agreed tee it up put out hustled away it's a life. Double live -- eager to life sentences that he was making anywhere from 65 to -- great idea -- lawyer that defense attorney that the taxpayers. Had to pony up all the money for across at least two million his appeal believing knows. That's what's really happening in Massachusetts prison system and -- real muscle and even an American citizen we spent two million on his defense Paul you lied acts at all. I don't know I love VI I love the course is in prison -- all -- I'm wondering where the atheists are because if you can be a lot of Christian spiritual things. They've actually try to not -- but they've put them into the printer. Didn't have a strange. So adamant that school that took a lot of the power they wouldn't have so many people in prison. Heidi is you so right about that -- is funny they can not say one nation under god in a public school. But any public prison and they have they -- American spiritual circle indeed part of the native American spiritual circle. But there is actually and I don't know what this is pop maybe can help me out but there's a religion out -- added that. Worships -- rocks. Our chief you know my other Arabs they're public. You know what -- what do not Christian stepped in here are sure I'd where the atheists complaining. You -- gonna drop a dime to those that goes hand rides ever run that religious. Gordon -- -- -- tried to sue acting in because the school BN was playing one nation under god. Yeah I know why don't wanna take the the god did not know what they crossed the other day on dial up. Do you feel to make opening up an atheist president there are atheist prison organization. You know that's a very good point Paul big Jewish drop and that's about all of these different prison programs that they have them. Are you get real audio won't want that and think about -- while they sit in jail what in well -- the best about the rock worshippers is that as part of their religion. They actually convinced that apartment correction to let them bring rocks from the prison yard into this house. Steve recent violence against it CEOs like need to end all day and Sylvia had done a western. Considering those two guys almost as murdered by convicts having rocks to worshipping you -- might not be such a good idea what it. Well what well what about you what about the fact that if you kill a person -- in Iraq does that mean Egypt's stand -- I think did Paul that's I think correction officers' union is still fighting about the rock worshippers and whether or not. Thought you know that keep key. Weakens the ones who -- -- and blocks they get to have a key every full moon courtesy of the taxpayer. God love on the -- lot of men who could forget suited up. Of course she didn't do which he's also the only person I know that has two primary residence that -- just. Be sure which more and she she -- her character let's primary residence. Full time resident says she -- RR -- My -- exactly. Hey I I didn't appreciate one of the palms from the poetry workshop roses are red. But it's a blue you paid to this home in my new boobs still. -- -- -- -- Steve the lawyer if they -- Bob for the call is they have a song you paid for in the prison poetry program bars like Steve the lawyer just did. Out there about ten years ago for my book group I had an odd they ran and she wrote Shakespeare behind died. And it was the program that was out of the Framingham women's prison to help women appreciate Shakespeare. But I want to check out the Billings Montana women's prison. It's obviously in Billings. And look how they need programs they have because I have to denotes someone who had a lady friend who they are now -- that a repeat offender. Who took all bunch of drugs went the wrong way about highway and nearly ten got a dozen people. And it's cheap -- that it -- ministry at the local adult detention center by the state did a cemetery she violated her probation by the way by going out drinking in public. -- -- -- now she's been telling you did got like a dog program they've got to cosmetology program mean she doesn't have to worry about and neat thing. You haven't -- behind -- and the need you on the outside thank you for the crop on the outside. You can't be he. You cannot. Taxpayer funded Whoopi -- If you wanna -- -- Ever so humble pie company we are gonna talk about that again today. You can and get a taxpayer funded anything you want a Wiki full moon cake. On the taxpayer. Big beautiful on the show -- we are AM six CD WRKO 6172666868. And you does have a home for us that perhaps might have been penned behind the wall as part of the poetry club the Massachusetts. -- index I'm Michelle we see we are AM to. -- -- -- Many times we drag -- home. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- But I'll just don't believe you can commute time -- wow. Always. You think yeah Johnny Cash throw this in the poetry program to better prison poetry program. I think prisons probably a little bit different. I think it might have been just a little bit different in the south LSU thing imagine it's been a little bit different for that guy. It's at least hopes those present is pretty cool. -- actually better than college does you just said Cynthia Rodriguez looked up what just hit the ocean breeze. That's. Now the last time the DOC released -- grant money was given to prisoners. To get college education there was three point seven million dollars so fire every time I have to listening -- Warren why main. About the high cost of college. Once again and -- reiterate. -- you liver transplant. On the taxpayer. Get locked up he needed EU theater arts degree. -- locked up. You wanna get is now. I don't know a barber -- places get locked up. If you wanna just -- -- me is. -- luck there the the stated the RG and they have health programs if you I don't what it means to worship -- rock. Get locked up if you wanna apply to deal in. Get locked out because it's the school and college. That's what -- set on -- stomach -- we are at WRK out. 6172666868. The outrage of the day is up next when a company offers 10% off if you think there. When they offer 15% off you think okay. But when you hear 20% off he think now you're talking I'm Carl -- from renewal by Andersen replace the windows here in Massachusetts. Right now and only through September 8. Save 20% on your entire window water that's windows in insulation. 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