Radio Today-Garrett Quinn

News. -- -- when. The same succeed WRKO. Boston's talk station you can call and it. 6172666816. No number 6172666868. Or you can -- us at 680. Sixty. What all the different oh lead in -- what are they different media and saw today -- usually gone with. Osama slayer first as I slide this back in August. But this week was a big event in radio in Boston and I thought it would be appropriate to go with modern lovers. -- router which is this classic. Boston rock song Jonathan Richman. They were in the rocket -- WBZ and rock and roll rumble like you -- years ago and that was a that was there I think it was a big song I think that ended up getting when he helping them win that but that's always at the song. A lot of the bumper song injured here they're gonna be about radio because there was a big event. In Boston radio this is this month and that big big event boss read this week. -- next a long time. Rock station is that was that is big has been sold to Iraq clear channel can you clear channel and that sort of is that what you're saying that as the nail in the coffin for. Rock radio nailed the coffin for independent local radio in the city and to an end generally of WF annex -- really day. A unique. Station in Boston -- any other country don't really have a lot of independent rock stations anymore. Dave disorder on the way. That don't have -- And joining me -- -- to talk about this for the next hour alone with a couple against her to have in his dot help our she wrote this great call -- Abouts. She was great -- -- Kennedy's web site about sort of the decline of of of rock and rock radio but also sort of how WF and -- I think you called -- the nail on the -- call the nail in the coffin would you what was the last night title is of killing Radio One station at a time that because a couple of years ago WB CN went away and rivers and they were the famous they were famous rock station in this town for quite a long time. That really going he's WA AF down the hall which is of a rock station this town has actual. Live. He young IJ -- and WY and vocal and yet he's -- to some degree that that's all automated there's no I -- in this at least when he -- Friday and it AF place a slightly different type of rock and roll today at heart it's a bit -- it's also they -- one more classic capsule it -- on there that's fine. -- but but but they have the thing that they have that WBS doesn't know six uses. DJs they have an local and who don't know ZLX says of -- you have people but it's it's -- -- dining -- yes a dying art so. I and you you've also written extensively about the she wrote a book guy think of Boston radio in 1920 to 2010 I did you corrected this it. Also it's also beautiful beautiful bought book as well not only the of the right April some of these you got incredible archive photos I'll lot of them. My personal collection might commitment and I and I wouldn't -- talking pre show I said you know I feel like the -- acts and speaks for the trees. I speak for the radio listeners. Not like and so arrogant I think you know I'm so important but I -- media historian and I feel an obligation to preserve the history of Boston radio and its history that isn't. Over yet I think the what we have right now to some degree we'll talk about the use his -- planned obsolescence. Radio whether a hammer FM does not have to be dead. But there are some unfortunate decisions. That are killing and we can I disagree on the politics and I think we'll all agree. -- live and local radio they're still in need for it it's still compelling it's still works and windy it's done right it can still get listeners even in our modern multimedia world. Might guess the -- dot -- she's an assistant professor of communication at Leslie unit university. Basil she's been or forty years in broadcasting and is written -- out of a -- or five books about. Radio and broadcasting in general. Or an -- she's -- you just finish your Ph.D. I think I know -- yes indeed yes and does that took forever on a 435. Page dissertation don't even ask. But you know what you gotta be challenging yourself you gotta be pushing yourself one night he always wanna learn new things. Not that WW RKO dopey guy it is stations this they'll have always sort of pushed local programming. It from a commercial and they've done pretty they've done and really a great job of that. But but the WF and exit it was -- those unique. Diamonds the Roth at at least in the modern media world where they were they working independently -- they were. A rock station day an and they didn't really seem to be all I think what I think the road dog the Brody the odds broke something along I'd be washed set up. Fed we didn't have the merger from buy ratings because we didn't have came in -- and I want this to happen now. Out of him out that what. But did you do have to keep the lights on you do have to do I hate and bell and you and I get it does cost you for what I completely get that but you know what. Once upon upon kingdom faraway people went into radio. Because they loved it okay radio is still we -- my hard news I'm not gonna complain about be in a professor I get to a you know most trained journalists in the broadcasters of tomorrow and that's all very nice. But my heart is still in broadcasting and it breaks my heart to see what's happening to it and it seems to me. That what you're -- you're doing today. Used to be an awful lot more calm and not just like you when I sit around chatting. But they're used to be on number of independent entrepreneurs they used to be a number of owners and I mean let's not. Idealized them somewhere very good some were very terrible. But at least they were options for the listener. Unfortunately. Since the 1980s. And the deregulatory movement and I understand for some people while deregulation. It's great. In this case it's allowed six giant conglomerates. To control most of broadcasting. And sadly they're making their decisions based on bottom line rather than and including. Full load of radio. No I'm not saying in independent owners were perfect and I'm also not saying that every clear channel station is terrible I'm not saying that at all. But I am saying that when you're looking at 868. By eight stations. The problems of little WS the next kind of aren't as important as well it's -- and leverage this with some. I can have like a group by it would six -- stations in the market. As opposed to what is Boston really neat. -- -- I want opposes call question out to my listeners to -- were when it comes radio obviously -- do like radio you're talking to one of the few formats that's. You're listening to one of the few formats it's growing it's talk spoken word radio is actually -- -- is is growing while music shrinking I want I want was this question the ice to. Do you miss. Rock and rock and roll rock rocket that's a paraphrase around did you miss rock are already do you miss. The radio that you do more. Experimental radio that you grew up with or. Did that get tired you are you happy with what you hear -- the airwaves now or do you just -- talk radio do you find more interest in the you have all these callers Alter how I wanna. According here for I don't hear what you are you sad about WF the next going away were you sad. When WB -- and went away please can you call 617266. 66. -- -- -- your your your 6860 when -- some New York. Bob Boston radio memories -- also Texas at 6680. I certainly you know the station for years broadcaster Gerry -- Williams alleged -- of the legendary. The legendary. -- talk radio master who really sort of -- who who really. Blazed the trail for talk Reno walk her country. I don't interruption I was here I was not not like here here is the studios to change that I was at WRKO and it was a music station. I was he's sixteen yeah right XDAWRKR. Yeah I was hit line operator which -- and was all they would let girls it is just before at Tennessee -- -- all of yes indeed this goes way back and back. But I say there are some friends of mine who are listening today showed until all the Russian listeners. And I don't mean rushed the talk show host I mean Russia the rock group. And people ask me all the time and I'm known for having discovered the rock group Russian dedicate did they dedicated to albums to me a minute documentary about them etc. etc. And all the time I get rock group sending me tapes -- discovered me the way you discovered in the answer is snow and that's part of the problem. You used to be able to take chances W at the next was known for taking chances. On new news there were so many groups that work. They got their first airplay because of what happened on. The radio and I'd love to see -- come back I think that's one of the reasons why young people aren't listening rather than hearing the same old same -- But Mike Mike Mike -- to to that is and when I -- a lot of the young people I know that it is speaking as a as a young as a young person to death and -- week. Our young interior to see on there then I I know a lot more young people that listen to talk radio whether it be sports should. But of course I or -- as a -- elect of York -- yes then listen to you agree I think beach after Nexus One of the few station I think people still -- do. BC and to -- that I think BC and sort of had this I think after edit this left WBZ and really kind really struggled. If it really struggled to to do to be visible to but. But put up. -- -- you're talking about sort of the -- to -- the target of the consolidation isn't ready to talk us on how that's -- -- -- you decrease number choice -- people have. It's a major and persuade our finalist I'm opposed squishy there are almost double the number of radio stations there were 23 years ago. There are a lot more stations around is -- that's draw wise I honestly. Because that's likes analysts 500 channels except the 500 channels buying and larger controlled by again 6% what is in a generation but isn't isn't it better though that people had the -- I think it's a shallow compared to -- television set. Three things a little different because of television is much more nationalized. Dan. -- in at least -- Saying that the decisions are very often taken out of the hands of the local programming people for example OK when I discovered rush. I was able to take that album. Get it played. Get them promoted not me along but other people on the station I was at at the time W and then next. Today in many cases the decisions are made far far away everyone's -- tracked everyone syndicated. And the local autonomy. Is. Really lacking. But it put. In in Boston though it does that doesn't really seem to be the case -- most at least -- most rock stations. You still have. Local TJ is that going there even though they may not have the freedom they had 102030 years ago. But but I think it's the ice agents can play but I knew when he got -- point is though is that the shift though was the -- sort of inevitable. For people young people take it away from -- with the movie the advance the development of personalized entertainment the fact that I can get an iPod. In the -- and custom program for myself. Playlist is very easily it's not it's a lot different than having to take the effort to. Go make a mixed tape could make CDs make a mix CD that I -- get that are likely to listen I can go on streaming radio I can get. I can cost until army radio stations for myself -- wasn't isn't the issue doesn't shift sort of inevitable it and consolidate here. GRE custom -- personality. OK there's only one Garrett does only one meat is only one Gerry Williams or David -- annoy you or for that matter Rush Limbaugh are anybody else. You can clone then you can have them on 672. Stations. But some day they're gonna die and somebody needs to be prepared to take over. States to be a farm team -- need to be -- and local personalities would got a lot of people listening was not just the music it was the personality on the cover of my book I'd get Arnie Ginsburg and I can tell you. Thousands and thousands of young people grow up listening to woo -- Ginsburg and they didn't just listened as he played the records just. Everybody played those records it was the way he -- it was that personality. Radio be friends you like no other mass medium. And I get -- tell you Garrett I disagree that all it was inevitable that truth is each new mass media and each new technology changes or accommodates. Other technologies. I think that radio was -- given up the fight in some levels -- shouldn't because there's still people look and feel that best friend they may be looking. In terms of other choices as well but they want to keep radio in the mix and we should give them something compelling and interesting to listen to. My guest in studio this hour's -- help -- she's the she's a professor a -- professor or an excuse me a professor Leslie -- a veteran broadcaster for four years. She recently report on the history of radio in Boston were Boston radio in 1920 to 2010. What I if you wanna join us this up just a starting cost 6172666868. I wanna hear from your particular are two things one. What are you would do his boss or you're certainly changed over the years. Do use just listen to talk radio and already still listen some music do you still assistant music radio and Q how do you listen to music do you. Do you use an iPod use pandora do you Spotify. Od. 617. 2666860. Let's go to Rick Ricky are next with care -- on -- succeed WRKO. -- afternoon he -- -- -- I'd like to listen to work talk radio but I like beer marketers to -- it. Illinois your music got Obama interrupted I think -- commercials. See he's got to be Rick's got a point there are -- that why so you Rick you don't like. You you you -- you are your part you do you have a Tivo or give DVR. And I just get through the commercials don't -- -- Everybody the so so it so Donna are Ricky Ricky ears are definitely part of a growing number of people I know. That -- that it did dinner are the try to avoid commercials -- is that is that even -- that he does have a point. But what about independent radio that that -- know stations don't have. That don't have commercials independent stations like WDR whenever. I think that there's a lot of ways around the whole commercial thing the truth. That the truth is that you have a number of stations that can broadcast commercials and an interesting way like public radio they'll sponsoring hours they of underwriting mentions we always joke about like this noncommercial was brought to you like yeah it is a commercial. -- years ago. They used to sponsoring -- hours even even commercial station you know this hour is brought you buy sell and sell and somebody gets mentioned at the top and mentioned in the middle -- radio affair back what -- this is irritated me is radio stations ago and here's when he minutes of music and then they interrupt every five minutes to tell you that you're listening to twenty minutes of uninterrupted music. Com but the -- it's not just the commercials it's the way their presented. If an announcer is a good announcer he or she can integrate the ad mentions in such a way. The the audience doesn't really feel -- interrupted again it's all about personality and I think that's what's really key to a successful station whatever the form. 6172666. Seats 68 I'm talking with -- help our about the future of radio -- impossible around the country. And I wanna I wanna do you do you still listen to music on the radio or do you just listen to talk out of I. I do wanna point out dot dot talk radio I spoke her I guess is it's technically don't spoken word radio is is growing. Expect it is growing significantly -- we were lucky here that -- Boston entity at the station. We have a lot of local programming and I think don't have that a lot of other places in the country particularly in rural. And rural communities. And that's one of the reasons why you know unlike the or hate them public radio serves a really important need nanny stations. In the public network. Carrie you know like all things considered but they also have a local talk show they have a lot -- music shall -- local what ever. And for many listeners that's their link with the community. I don't have a problem with syndicated programming I have a problem when it's only allocated for a let's go let's go to -- in Dorchester Keith you're now to check out front door just I was born and -- just hard -- keep. I'm doing great are provided really wanted to thank -- -- break -- rush because they're one of my bigger fan but I left there that documentary -- -- -- And that you know I'm a band and it's. Impossible now to try to get your. But other products are that I local radio show that -- for about two hours at night there's really no champion of I mean the issue that was awesome back in the early nineties they could find good bit to get out there and now you don't have that boy I mean. And and put that thing and it now has to be a -- all the sudden became the -- DC and the like Tom Petty is but how did it look like mine. I'm just happy we have a rock station. They try to be all things to all people. While they've never been -- for a better demographic but they're losing the core fans that made WA AF special. It's separated AF -- in the same could be -- -- -- the way and that and after in the 2000 and had no real core audience they. -- What what -- what do you make it WFX that's sort of the big news this week that that's the big news -- we were talking about. What do you make it W laugh at an exciting off they were and and they were they were and independently on rock station and they were for for profit they were commercial radio station. And a lot of people and including myself would argue that W up Max was was cutting edge to -- before it was pretty sort of took off. Took the cutting edge torch after WFA aft after WDC and change change in the ninety's and in the eighties that the did this a nexus sort of this. Was this station that can get away with whatever they want because they didn't have to did you anything is welcome but it at the same time. The Dade -- data making money in this they think they averaged monies -- this from what my understanding. Well I mean it was a it was a Cuban radio station I'm actually got the play there a couple times you know I had I perform my -- slot -- Get better opposition perspective a couple of years ago. And it was I mean branded it was a land. And I don't know how big they're broadcast such a lot but I respected their music they had good music but I also because they stayed. So far it's just one media didn't branch out so they're they're core audience wasn't the same. I think AF do the same thing right now the opposite way. -- -- switched into what they're doing in the they're gonna lose those court and it just so that to try to get -- guys. Second look into the same that they got a hundred point seven at the same radio station now. -- Radio came really late to the party in terms of embracing new technologies. I'm not a tech wizard on. But I and as I understand is a lot of devices don't even play AM on them they only play FM. Quite -- my phone only does that young and I also am understanding that the the way that radio was program today. Doesn't allow for fully utilizing web sites interactivity. Tower that they've come really let's let's -- our stations have come late to cash. Thanks that doubt we go let's move along we go to our Ernie before go to the break birdie in New Hampshire I just wanna get UN. Ernie you're up next with Derek went on -- succeed WRK off. I guess I don't hate crime ridden Brooke. And I packet in this. I know yeah -- -- -- -- until they reckon getting a lot in the rubble of the 900 does islands yeah. I wanted to -- common -- or commercials. I still listen approximately fifty years in the news recently I've been listening. Throughout. The process took over David but -- -- -- -- -- Do you agree yeah I mean it's just a bit more commercial and it didn't actually talk on the radio. Fortunately he got I -- -- -- -- -- like I like you know like this show but if he did actually if you get a few times an -- is -- commercials and rock. And that's a real problem because on the one he India need to make money need to pay the bills on the other hand people -- wanted to hear their favorite song -- their favorite talk show host and they don't want to be interrupted so high do you find a balance. The campaign you haven't we have to pay the bills contention we have to take a break as we've gone almost a half hour without taking a break here. That I -- you look like you -- this idea wanna play out that I don't think it it's true that you have as many commercials as his car we just when a huge block there thought haven't gone. But now we do have to take a quick break here we get back her talk with Peter chances of the Boston Phoenix and he is the the the -- head honcho over there and we're gonna talk to him about WA AF -- and and where radio is headed -- this -- around the country you're listening in DOC to Gary -- and -- -- WRKO. The dude rock and roll. Radio -- let's rock and roll. Welcome back you're listening to and succeed WRKO my name is Gary Quinn. That was the Ramones with rock and roll radio. I was I was such a great sound that was I was a great that was off the end of the I'm not rocket to Russia here which record that was off of. Well you gotta I used to play at -- and these simple yeah. That was wreckage that was. But I know are Arabs buy there are trying to remember the name of the filled with Phil Spector pretty yes yes that -- the wall of sound. Don't get me started -- did you think by the way that guided -- all these girl groups went on to produce the Ramones. Because then he ended up dating one of the the the the lead -- -- the run I dated Ronnie Spector which -- she wishes she never did that episode. You know she was that that was a very tempestuous relationship but -- the -- by the -- put out on -- -- all I believe absolutely unbelievable music the -- remains yes. 617. 26668686172666868. Yards -- -- it's only dictating. My guest this hour is dot help our -- She just read her book on she's great she's an off there or five books as well as a professor at Lesley College. She wrote a book the history of Boston radio in 1910 in 191920191022. Wanted to thank each 120 -- -- And you were guessing about vinyl yes it was it was nice. It's said were you around this year a little younger than me I'm still young and cute that your our -- little younger than me I pretty much grown up with C. d.s OK see you are mainly with CDs okay. Because I still remember of course you know when I went on the air in college radio and then of course when I did the rush -- on they -- me a vinyl album which I still. And those for the days when that record promoter should bring you in the records you'd just choose the ones you thought were the best wants to see that kind of thing again -- -- did that sort of thing. But now we ESP a WFA next BI have a -- guests this half hour join us as well joining us is your taxes he's the executive better of the Phoenix media. Peter thanks for coming -- and they really appreciate it oh let me I have to imagine this has been a stressful week for you guys over there opera -- out. Now let's spend you know what it's it's been emotionally wrenching I mean I've been. With the Phoenix for 24 years. -- the next was up and running but it was really just getting it seemed -- You know 24 years ago those stations 29 years old and it was really just beginning to take offense. You know when the earliest I work. Really closely with people there especially next fall off in Kurt Thomas and the you know like losing a member of the freedom. Is it really has been ranchers and see what what sort of makes it doubly painful. Is. The outpouring. Of you know sympathy and regret he gets from people -- I was in Jamaica Plain and when I was. You know what passes for downtown. A little early this morning memorable people you know came up to me and go basically saying hey what a bomber. What did was this a shock to you or did you know this was -- -- is it seems it seems like. That this was. -- -- talk and talk about this for years. But it's it it it it died down recently and then all of a sudden. I'm on my way to work in a friend -- -- DL -- W got the next disease allows want. What was like surprised yes was like shocked no. You know over the years especially recently. But and a number of people had. Approach -- individual owns the Phoenix and aframax. As you know do different things and he really didn't want to do anything different with the station. But finally you know clear channel needs of a very strong offer. It was just constant reports he walked one of the problems with an independent stations like aframax. Playing this sort of music. That it has some audience that's not survey ample. And -- radio perhaps more than any other corporate. Media is. You know what a prisoner of ratings are our listeners are eighteen to 35 they don't have what you were -- -- -- survey. And as a result you know ratings were very to get. But the real measure of how popular. WS the next once was it's also the pro concept -- that would be sold I hope. Mariah and take place yeah. I -- we don't want anyone at the audacious legendary green DHL in 1994. -- Peter I know exactly what you're talking about you and I have worked together in May not have realized it com. In the early days of the station -- I was here consultant very briefly and on the one that recommended that Macs be hired. And -- -- good. Thank you that it was a very good consultant again Italian. But I'm Steve it was a very good owner and I'm not just saying that -- I haven't worked for the -- -- years I'm saying that. He really stood by that format and you're right it's a niche format he has a very small but passionate audience. And that's a really issue and that's where radio was kind of at a crossroads today because. Will those niche format slight chance. Like real progressive rock like WS the next used to play will those formats which don't do well in ratings but hit eight. Passionate core of listeners will -- somehow find a way to monetize that so that they can survive. You know what you are more of an expert. I mean an idea. But when you say passionate. Some -- the statement. I mean this goes back years in the night you mentioned green game which as you know maybe the best known example. But I I remember I was sitting with David -- briefings -- Guys from the MDC police and the they would only have in effect wasn't born. We know how to handle crowds if you know -- that's for the July -- -- in the last words the you know what washing it. Copied it and Mike says it's not physical violence audience but it's an energetic ones and it's young. But outside of maybe even as the single best -- I remember. Was one we have around the mighty mighty Boston -- I'll play great to be out there today say yeah I'm they -- that they were. Playing right in front of the -- people. And John Lyons and ask me what was the outcome of how's -- -- goes oh don't worry but it's going to be a little I paused. Energetic forceful. I just a one I wanted to ask if I wanted to ask you -- I -- here. Do you is it still possible to run an independent locally or oriented commercial blocks radio station in a major market. Well. I'm one would never say never putted extremely difficult. You know you have first of all the ratings issues a lot depends on the format. You know I suppose if you playing dinosaur rock. Which I say respectfully a little but raised my eyebrows but that might be a bit easier but. What. The whole world and thoughtfully. Media and big city markets is question. You know it's a national advertising. Wants you know by an audience in the top ten markets. On the -- are they gonna go to someone that's corporately. Old. So they can trigger they -- audience the right way and get the you know what they see is the best. -- -- -- -- I think the economics of it -- really tough for -- and I think that's why. If so it up that early states and my my my my guests this half hour -- dot helpers she's the author of the history of Boston radio 1910 to 20192020. And I would get that right. -- into the show I apologize she's a professor at Lesley College is on the line your dad's -- he's the executive -- easy executive editor. Of ball Phoenix media. Go ahead. Yeah I I just wanna talk about the whole media consolidation thing. I know a lot of listeners. Are very free market and this was kind of not free market -- the -- planned obsolescence and -- hold on to dominos fell. What Peter and I are both very aware of this years ago. If you weren't -- station. The people it's supported use the most with a record companies. That media consolidation has not just affected. Radio stations it's affected record companies it's affected textbook companies affected all kinds of people who used to wanna get -- young audience. And with fewer and fewer and fewer choices. You no longer have like nine or ten or eleven or twelve record companies of all we will support your concert or text book coming yell will support your concert this and that. The monetization. Issue. You still have fans you still have listeners but you don't have as many potential advertisers and that is crippling broadcast. -- and also from an audience point of view I I have teenagers people. My eighteen year old son the only time he listened to the radio that just happens to be dropping what. I know how that in the piece I wrote for median nations and I Teddy and. Yeah it in again. Now take the thirteen year old -- twins -- thirteenth here or in art com more often because they are. Still not independently driving him here in the -- you know they -- into the radio but. -- You know ever since the walk me. That debt has cast the shadow on the whole radio world that was that the iPod. I'm in every one of your own program director. Here we have a take a quick break here can you stick around for a and -- are right. You're listening to and succeed WR KL my name is Derek -- We're gonna take a quick break here Peter and -- will be back us for the next segment. -- -- -- -- -- This out this record came out to your I was born. Move. -- and it's -- and it's not entirely true video didn't kill the radio star radio has reinvented itself so many times and I'm sure that Peter shares my belief that radio can reinvent itself again. You're listening to -- -- this is -- Quinn on -- succeed W York you know joining me for the remainder of the hour here. Donna help -- from Lesley college and Peter -- he is the executive editor. At Phoenix media about we're talking about today the sale of WF the next the last -- Last independent rock station in the Boston market to. Clear channel you wanna join the conversation you can cost 617266. 6868. He also Texas at 66 the -- here for your particular -- listen music now do you do you listen to it. Do you use pandora Spotify. Your iTunes Internet radio about. The endless amount of options available to you on the unity and as a radio stations all over the country and all of the world. Or 88 do you still like to. But still deal transistor turn on and -- in the dial an -- and as some some local local programming. 6172666868. Texas 6680. Peter a lot more throws you. It -- there's talk about the the consolidation of radio -- in -- talked about this how it's watered down the market how it's taken away choices. But don't don't really have more choices than ever now with things like the Internet with satellite radio. With with with with -- -- iTunes with which your -- I can listen to with my -- I can listen to any race -- want. Anywhere in the world. Well short lesson in Boston you have some you know terrific college stations WEEI around WUN be. I'm the as the burn out of Berkeley on the Internet via you know PIR -- Internet radio I'm. But if the paradox at work here all of this choice. Which is great for consumers. Presents real challenges when you when you put -- in -- into commercial. Oh -- you know when you get into the profit making him. You know maybe the future of independent radio was a College Station I mean. -- -- that lastly I mean. I'd be curious what she thinks about that. Well for rising gas station right Leslie is hoping to get a station on an error in. We haven't decides to be very honest with you I was brought -- I was at Emerson for nineteen years. And I was brought over to Leslie to create their communication major which is now the second fastest growing major on campus and we're getting a lot of interests. So far we've concentrated mainly on print. And then you just paper over their right we've gotten the advisor in the person that started the new student newspaper award winning student newspaper. But it really wants it won the award last year for the best new student organizations -- -- spent a lot of -- I think there's been a lot of interested non print journalism but there's also been a lot of interesting getting a radio station. There are still people who would like to do it but -- -- right. -- this generation has grown up in a world where radio is irrelevant fourteen change it doesn't need to be if we can create some compelling interesting unique programming and promoting it to that demographic. I think we could be back in the mix now -- the world has changed could we be the only only like when -- when I grew up yeah probably not but can we be won all. Absolutely -- perfectly happy to be in the mix I don't expect everyone to. Only do X wires eight but if I can be a -- included. I'm happy camper and I'm still -- a few books. Here are lets us baton -- back tears while. That did. That. They're they're just they're Sony choices now I promise of a -- earlier. Wasn't this the won't -- isn't that the ship the ship isn't the shift away from release for younger people is is a permanent this plays or anything. They can bring people brat back to terrestrial radio. You know I don't know that for sixty. The 4000 dollar question. I she's -- I should preface this to music. Radio. Right what I was gonna say that. It's very interesting that -- You know twenty plus years of surveying. The listening happen. Law of. Readers of the Phoenix newspapers. In Boston the two most popular stations -- FM experts which isn't surprised it and like -- points behind W. WB you walk. And so our audience has always been split between you know what I would call. Smart highbrow talk and end rocket -- It's -- -- something interesting though -- Peter Doherty interrupt you on in my neighborhood okay. I've some nine and ten and eleven year old neighbors when Quincy eloquently. Okay and when. North Koreans and right near the expressway and there is coming to visit. I'm having a heck of a daughter. I'm not seriously you know there's been some wonderful kids in my neighborhood and they didn't listen to radio they listen to -- one way this and that. And they're growing up we is -- radio. Now will they stay within. I don't know at some point we lose them and that's what we need to take a look at their art kids who want to listen to a good personality station. How do we keep them I say we still -- Well but but how closest challenger we -- -- by thirteen year old twins while yet. -- Just all not to bad I just wanna make that clear. I but I imagine that -- is the musical taste of faults to include. You know other types of music. You know I can find a way to verify that on most of those stations that -- on the Boston dial. I I I I I really got about a minute and a half here Peter. Is there any chance that -- I know there's talk of visited it's still early I know there's talk that W a FedEx is gonna go to possibly go to the Internet. Is there any chance to get back in to -- to over the air broadcast because my understanding is. It's extremely hard to that the the regulators to the FCC has made it it it's extremely difficult to buy into and extensive financial -- -- -- its first small business owner it's it's really hard is there any chance that and I only got about a minute. Well listen I never say never. I think it might be a long shot but. Even retain the call weapons that you know the Phoenix owns W whether it's WS cynnex. He handle all the intellectual property that's associated with the station. You know I'd love to see aframax rise again I don't know whether it be on your analogue line on the year all -- but. One thing we know is this -- environments changes so fast that you be crazy to land it. And is still in need for a Peter there's still people that want it and love it. I agree my have my guest this past hour -- peace Katz's he -- the meat in the executive editor. At Phoenix media and -- help -- she is a professor at Lesley college and also an author author of the book. Boston radio 1920s Detroit and I finally got to write a I think both the coming coming on. They just take a break for the news this is -- succeed WRKO.