Not illegal to lie about Medal of Honor
Wed, 18 Aug 2010|
A federal law making it a crime to lie about receiving the Medal of Honor or other military decorations violates freedom of speech, a federal appeals court ruled Tuesday. Although a Southern California water board member convicted of violating the Stolen Valor Act made "deliberate and despicable" claims that he had received the Medal of Honor, the Constitution prohibits the government from prosecuting someone for merely lying, the Ninth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in San Francisco said in a 2-1 ruling. Should lying about being a Medal of Honor winner be against the law?
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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)
But it's a really interesting court case that came down yesterday that I'd like -- get your opinion on. Back in 2006. That congress passed a law. Passed a law an infected passed the US senate unanimously. That doesn't happen very often. Called the stolen. Valor. Act the stolen valor act. In it forbids. Any one. -- we're a military medal that wasn't burned or to claim that they won military partners that they didn't. Current. And the measure sailed through congress blatant 2006. Receiving unanimous support by the Senate. And Audi in California -- there was a guy you mean to Xavier Alvarez Pomona California. And he. Was a water district board member. And he said it demeaning a public meeting in 2007. That he was a retired marine. Who received the medal of honor which of course is our nation's highest military decoration. Well of course. It wasn't true he pleaded guilty he was indicted in 2007. Under this does stolen valor act. And he yacht pleading guilty on the condition. That he be allowed to appeal on First Amendment grounds. And he was sentenced under the salt stolen valor act to more than forty. 400 hours of community service. At a Veterans Hospital. So so far they say dozens of people have been arrested on the law. And almost all the impostors have been awarded to perform community service no one has stopped. Yeah I guess they plea bargain it out they perform community service when they get caught. You know claiming. Remember there was a whole mall and string of stories of political figures in public figures who claim for instance that they had served in Vietnam. Just like god that guy running for the US senate down in in non Connecticut. You know claimed he served in Vietnam. So I wonder if he would be. If you can be arrested under the stolen valor act. But anyway this guy. -- here Alvarez. Appealed to it. To the Supreme Court to the courts the federal courts. And saying that under the First Amendment which gives us freedom of speech. He did the right to lie. And the ninth Circuit Court of Appeals has ruled two to one. That the law making it a crime to falsely claim military honors. Is unconstitutional. Because it's low key because there is a right to lie. Under the free speech law. Under the First Amendment. Isn't that amazing. You know the First Amendment is so you know when it was drafted. And put in our constitution those first ten amendments the bill of rights. In here -- a situation where everyone agreed this law passed overwhelmingly. Became part of the federal law. This guy appeals when he gets caught saying that he -- one he says he's it was a decorated Marine One the congressional medal of honor. And of course he lives and he's saying well that loss should be thrown out because under free speech I should be allowed to lie. And -- little bit moron it. It is 21 really the appeals court found that the stolen valor act is unconstitutional. The majority throughout the prosecution of elected member of the California water board. Xavier Alvarez who claimed at a median 2007. In on previous occasions. That he was a former marine and a recipient of the congressional medal of honor. Would judge mylan Smith said the law went too far. Even though many legal experts view deliberately false speeches unprotected. By the constitution. So I guess that comes down that's what cut it comes down to should go right to free speech. Also protect cool nice. If you're caught lying about something in a situation. In a case like this difference since I got the congressional medal of honor -- served you know in Vietnam. There's a law are against it the stolen valor law. And -- act and then you say well you know what I live in that's protected under freedom of speech in this should be unconstitutional. Does that make sense TU. Does that make sense to use that lying should be protected language. Let's take couple calls on this I think it's a really interesting court decision. You know something like the 9/11 mosque. Sort of feel it you've got you know one way or the other on this one. Boy I don't wanna mess with the First Amendment and I believe in protecting freedom of speech. Should lies be covered under freedom of speech. Let's go to while bother -- your next to Charlie many how you doing Bob.
IR Kelly guys. Special personal feel what it's -- and they did serve under. Lieutenant that that the congressional level fought in Vietnam and actual. 1960 -- that they. That's what a slap in the face every -- it a little or deny that it's not an effort to anybody to certain services. And -- under Awad decorations still lightweight. It's just very good idea it would start going like -- no no -- who dig into and they'll bury itself. You know -- is that -- and you know I had a personal spiritual law the same things start that also what is fast. And the final you gonna do this trip to thirteen date -- Alabama cargo every emissions are -- You lose. They're out there he never ED classes of the universe you'll all the Vietnam war on all my -- dressed up. You're just like a full bird -- unbelievable.
Relay. -- any any only served you served a very short time and was kicked out.
Actually never serve because it made its political you know why. It never. It up at night -- and apparently they're he's Serb side source it's it's just just just give you some idea. -- what the country gone opposition like it died so whatever else like to pick I mean what we thought -- I mean they wanna keep shut its sex education actually. And Wally -- it's worth it also to address the audience that's that's the ball thank that is what brought you what we record an awful thing about the current. He can't do that ride but it's gonna happen -- freedom of speech.
That's a short. Hey Bob thanks a lot and thanks you service we really appreciate it Paul look how are you next to -- Manning.
Hello Kelly how are you that I. They're out.
Carmelo Burton you know they're they're not like the president think that they don't win that you heard there. Okay and it would need a good speech go to stop let down I mean I can't -- big girl why is there any lightbulb you'll win my kids think they've been. Lied about -- Now it is not a public arena. Okay because. If they're -- last Larry -- how liable so but Obama each picked up all night.
You need to need -- totally believe in free in the speech. But it seems like you could exclude lying to somebody her this leave. In out Regis we who lies like this guy did out in California at a public meeting you know he's a member of the waterborne. Any -- now they're saying on the congressional medal of honor winner why should all know why you're -- and -- the protection of the First Amendment.
Well or will not vote and you you know what however would get it triggered cowboys lost something.
And I know well. Obviously he was lying from the start. And Don you know we'd he had set it for years he beat -- you know these guys out did that just totally fool me up all that stuff like little guy running for the US send it in nine in Connecticut. -- totally lied about having served in the in Vietnam.
Yeah helpful tool if it's lying just saw a lot protected by the first -- about the --
That's absolutely true why are there perjury charges you could go in and say. Hey death shouldn't count because some I can lie under the First Amendment -- even if like swear on the Bible like in my.
Absolutely right don't go I appear considered off.
But I think a lot go. The only thing they convicted of the month was one count of lying to the FBI. -- you know -- winds protected speech if you can stand up and lied about receiving the congressional medal of -- Why can why can't you -- the FBI why would that be protected speech.
That's exactly. Well if I let him.
Yup I sure think so hey -- good points I appreciate it. 61726666. It let's do Patrick in New Hampshire hey Patrick.
Payout could actually topic not by the way.
Yeah I thought I was reading this opinion last night nice that this is up my listeners wanna talk about I can tell you now.
I'm I'm okay so the National Guard veteran of Iraq and Afghanistan. I'm Rick -- got slightly different take -- a motor caller on their net. Yeah this -- go fire yeah he should be. Publicly -- the result. But you are pretty neat. And it other than soccer -- which you should not perjury. Nor should it plainly. -- hundred dollars or 300 dollars a month a little -- Recipient years regarding your behavior that whatever people -- and it had gone to jail for that. That's that's why under load and that's perjury -- lying -- Euro. I couldn't tell -- law in Seattle now longer. -- It doesn't mean the knowledge that it makes a kind of like an idiot. And they should. Chicken -- or players or whatever. My concern was saying no all. You win this to become alive is. Jim Brown's book the debate showed disaster -- a lot about the Catholic Church. Life the previous speeches you such a deadly tap toilet.
Yeah bullets just that he said it -- and he was a member of this water board didn't you know how water is a huge issue out there in California. So who's a member of the tell of a California water district board. So you wonder if he was an up their same. But hey you don't tell me on the congressional medal of honor winner I've got the high moral ground here because we're not you know I know like. Tom Kelly who is the head of veterans affairs I think he still is for the state. Under rob Mitt Romney and I think he still is under devolved. And when I meet him I the most melts it you know to meet -- aggressive and he's the most humble wonderful guy. But it's it's just. It's one of the greatest auditors that anyone in our country can never receive are. Entirely very special people get them and I do think he gives them. I mean anything on veterans affairs. Tom Kelly you know he's he's the man you know -- I'm gonna listen to him on anything that to do with that.
Sure but you're -- returns. Copy yet in the a lot of security you don't why -- you -- in air and I I have that. I think two of my life that you medal of honor recipients. And now. In either one of them. Would stand up on -- crowd as saying well should do it because I have a little longer like that's the idea. What is what is probably why they are caught in the first place -- I actually 01 bottle of water Tribune. We're talking about stories you. In the city was invited or would -- like well here. You know I. You might feel differently. But. It is capacity or and Miley. Thing is that what you're saying don't realize it means it could. Not protected speech -- start sue OPEC all most of the drop but it should acknowledge. Songwriters. Well usually. Carter's mistakes. That would neurological lie. And that's where all like it. Sorry about -- you. Like there.
Hey Patrick excellent call lots of thoughtful calls on this every -- hang on line. We'll take quick break to will be right back we'll get you before the top of the hour get all these calls in here in the Charlie Manning show on WRK out. Breaking news announcements from your frequent -- Boston. --
Let's go right back to the calls on this we got a bunch -- interest in the story Mike in new near nexus Charlie Manning -- Mike.
Jolly nice to start the year two days is always a pleasure. Get a great show thanks. -- appreciate poll. Ashamed for men and -- to embellish his manhood. You should really have I have shut the people who men like that that would chase something that they're not. I think they got to tweak the law that is just say. For example Massachusetts. We have those vanity plates right like for -- Shall list. And even the congressional level auto I believe. Yeah you have to have documentation that you we receive those awards oh yeah absolutely. That would be falsifying a document in that would be illegal. But I think fantasy. That he was so metal -- recipient. Vishay polish citizen embarrassing it is is definitely protected under the that.
Free speech. You know -- combat veteran of Vietnam racial. Hezbollah war that I wish they had UV gets the call the combat infantryman badge. I would never wear it I would go.
