Partial Law in Arizona

24 hours after. The judge's decision judge Dalton's decision in Arizona. It's come down and we've read it her all about her decision. We have. Heard what it's gonna mean we've talked about what it's gonna happen politically. And the herald's of course has a terrific editorial today Arizona left adrift. And the federal government's not doing their job and securing our borders and stopping illegal immigration. Arizona tried to do it and now the judge ruled that no you can't do it that's gotta be up to the federal government. So we asked our our great immigration and illegal immigration specialist just scoop on form from the Center for Immigration Studies to join us once again today and we've got Jessica for a little while yesterday but now 24 hours since the decisions come down Jessica what's your reaction to all this what do you think's gonna happen.

Well I think. In the long run the Obama administration and -- really suffer politically for having -- the one that like this you know by the fact that. The decisions -- has gone their way. At least partially. Written good news and bad news. -- the bad news is of course that. The judge swallowed hook line and sinker. All of the misleading claims that the administration made about how -- going to be difficult for them. But the good news this is that she didn't really shoot down the idea. States having legislation -- concern -- concerned that gracious she let some of the stand. And it's inconsistent I think the things that she's not Evans and said.

What are some of the things that she lets the and that they're gonna be beneficial to this effort to control illegal immigration.

Well one thing is that she's allowing the legislature say there will be no sanctuary jurisdictions inherent. That they do have -- who will now crack down on. Those used jurisdictions that actually created they hate it legally. I'm so that's good and she let stand this section on state. Anti smuggling statute that that the state. And that -- where I really hasn't done enough in trying to shut down smuggling or. Now you know why you can have. An anti smuggling statute but not you know without ever part of the federal law that says you have to carry registration documents is. It seems to me consisted but the goodies that they can't be something. And she didn't shut down all police check. She just seemed to be. Bothered by the fact that. The law says that everyone arrested. We have to have is that there I can never mind that there are lots of other places in the country that already do this like New Jersey Colorado and Virginia Rhode Island and Rhode Island yes but. Mission in that from the Arizona is doing. So. But but I think you know one good thing is that many more police agencies and realize that they can. And you know they're not obliged to look the other way when they encountered lately so that's that could be used the oval. But you know -- it is disappointing. Because. And now we have to go to the next level is an appeal it and I think there's definitely open borders advocates and a trumpet this say you know. Book value bad state legislators don't even try. You do anything in this field because we're gonna come after you do it as one of my colleagues said Egypt lie in court. That'll give them.

6172666060. If you want to talk to Jessica Vonn of the Center for Immigration Studies. We're talking about the decision by the judge yesterday federal district court judge. Who. Overturned north. Lying go to war however you wanna put it. The move the parts of the Arizona. Illegal immigration law that really would have made a difference. There is as Jessica said so a little bit of good news there it did leave some things in there. But how you I'm sure you bald -- conference call that the Center for Immigration Studies in and tried to figure out what the next step is sent. How long would this -- to get to the Supreme Court if there was gonna go down that line do you have any idea just got.

I don't know exactly that I would have to think it could be a couple.

Couple years so definitely not before. This election.

Now okay that it had to go to burst through the ninth circuit court of appeal. And I don't know how want to take that there is some time involved now. I've you know I don't know it is possible but I've seen in other cases where some time. -- legislature or an executive branch of the state government might try to make corrections to the lot try to get around parts of the injunction right. I would. You know I I would. Think if they're looking at that and that might make sense given that. One part of a lot of fathered the judge at least you know that was a pretext. And right but the way it was worded about whether all people had at this that is verified is that what kept checking citizen than. You know all green card holder Peter and and that not intent of the -- Intent was to weed out citizens in green card holders and not bothered that. Only -- people with it was reasonable suspicion that they might see --

And Jessica I know we've talked about this before and show. But it is federal law that if your legal immigrants here did you always have to carry your paperwork for. With you write your green card or whatever else in case you're asked for right.

That is the way that is federal law and it's been that way since the 1940. So yet.

And so why would the judge. Think it's bad that if somebody is here legally. Or a citizen you know if if -- and and the amazing thing is they were only gonna do this in the case of arresting after someone's been arrested. So somebody I get arrested they're gonna say this many to give identification dot -- we see it. If you wore a -- illegal immigrant you're gonna pull out your green card. If you're illegally here you won't have identification you might have a Mexican driver's license or something from another country but you won't have one from here. -- Heidi who or why does that step over the line when it's been federal law for forever.

I'm acutely sensitive according to this judge. She believed the Obama administration when they said that it would be -- much work for them checked everybody. And that was overburden there queries system. Which is complete nonsense. And secondly because she thought that there would be too much possibility for US citizens and legal immigrants to be. Apple.

But it's only when they've been arrested right.

what traffic stops which are not necessarily read write and that was where I -- some concerns they said you know there's so many. I'm a traffic stop but again it. Part of that may come down some. Some language that can be changed to -- we only met at rest where everybody -- detective of course. There is any we thought it was funny you sometimes you have somebody may claim to be citizen and not actually Iwuh. You know they might have aliases they -- you know he's trying to cling to see from -- US citizens you know which won't do the immigration checks. But that should happen at this point -- that's not something to do on a traffic stop and I don't think any. Trooper patrol up there would even try that the only hit up that he believed some. But for the most part according to. But now candidate said you know if you show me an academic drivers wait a minute in the -- now more questions.

illegal immigrants get driver's licenses and Arizona.

No not not easily -- yet but they -- through a sophisticated fraud but.

I mean here are some states that do let like New Mexico let's illegal immigrants get driver's licenses right yes why ho why does too okay. 6172660. Boy did she know her stuff but does she know her stuff -- you're just the best and we're lucky to have. Jessica -- from the Center for Immigration Studies with us today. Talking about what happened with the Arizona decision what the next steps gonna be what the impact that this is gonna be in -- is I told you yesterday. This is a really bad news for the Democrats at the polls this year this is just gonna be another issue. They gets. Folks who are. An enthusiastic. And feel strongly about the illegal immigration issue is gonna get them out to the polls. And I just think did you see this building enthusiasm. On one side. Of the of the electorate in this is just gonna make it still builds on that enthusiasm people. Are not gonna be wait to be able to vote this November in so many of these races it's.

You know public opinion like you don't -- Against the administration's opening --

Oh yes absolutely people really mad that they brought this lawsuit and then haul but Eric Holder. The attorney general the United States seeing in an interview. In not only are we gonna sue but if this law goes into effect. We'll be back to start I charging people with. What do they call it out racial profiling. We're gonna send eighteen men and we're gonna build racial profiling cases.

That they hired something like sixty -- lawyers here at the Department of Justice. Specifically to form -- unit of lawyers that will go around the country. -- is buying cases of what they consider to be rampant racial profiling and on immigrant bashing going on all over the country is now. The defendant that kind of federal resources. This problem that in my opinion. Very.

And a day were up here in Boston and then of course we have been Mike's -- and -- we have a new US attorney named I think her name is Carmen -- T use. And the folks came up from a Eric holder's office in Washington and they said they were taking ten. Prosecutors. Federal prosecutors. Out of doing what they had been doing weather was political corruption cases mob cases. All the cases they were doing and putting them on a special teen. To start going after you know pieces of racial profiling and other civil rights cases ten lawyers assigned. Just here in Boston to a special civil rights team. And then they said. We're not just gonna sit back we're gonna go out and actively try to find cases to go after people. That's -- I am I right exactly I mean can you say hi I'm attorney general Eric Coulter. Do you think you've been racially profiled -- sexually harassed door civil rights violations may have been made against you. Will call my office today and will get you the money you deserve you know I mean that's basically what Eric Holder and these people doing -- the US attorney's office in Boston it's. It's crazy ended just had a good record of of prosecuting not political corruption that got the big case coming up. Against former speaker south of -- and yet the pulling trained prosecutors off -- important jobs. His -- blood into the stuff that's what's going on. Gosh let's grab some calls here for. Jessica -- from the Center for Immigration Studies for what is your least by the way the odd number on the number of new legal immigrants and Arizona did you guys are pretty good at judging this stuff.

In Arizona it read about 400000. About 400000. In here that the government 100000. Have left in 2007 when Arizona passed this. First -- off rye which by the way did pass. Constitutional muster in the ninth circuit. So. Is it working.

And near a little bit smaller population than we are. And we -- according to your latest study of Massachusetts we have about 220000. Illegal immigrants here in Massachusetts. So even though they're small population wise they double -- illegal immigrants so it tells you. Who tells you while what do problem it is out there. Let's go to -- Debra and then -- for your first this hour with Jessica -- of the Center for Immigration Studies on the Charlie Manning show hey Debra.

I -- you sign. I have a question. Am I get -- seem simple but I've never heard about. What would be wrong. With requiring citizenship. To get quote unquote free medical insurance. Housing subsidies. Forcing him. He's being held. Cause it seems to me that the benefits that are provided. For coming here illegally. Such that unless they're taken away. And if they would take it away it would be no incentive to come over here. Flight from the United States. Citizen. Drain the economy. And everything else and yet I never. Heard -- mention.

We'll Deborah that was the whole idea behind the Jeff Perry amendment you know Jeff carries the state representative he's running for congress in the tenth district. He every year he's filed this amendment in the legislature. That would force the government state government. To do to check the citizenship. Of people before they can see receive state benefits. And it's agreed idea here. And it actually came close there is as close as it's ever come I think it lost by what 1012 votes this year. In the house. When Jeff Perry proposed it and that was the whole idea behind it's what we call the Perry amendment. In in fact that's been holds on by Rasmussen and others. In between seventy. And 80%. Of the people of Massachusetts. Supports the Jeff -- amendment and what it would do.

Because if that will pass -- every state then it would literally be. Like -- Arizona. Law has I believe caused people to flee Arizona but if they just simply. Transfer to another state and their overburden at state. Nothing is it nothing is accomplished.

Well that's what's going on we didn't see a pretty strong exodus of illegals in the last couple weeks in Arizona didn't we on Jessica.

Yes that's what people are reporting from Arizona that. A lot of people were waiting for a lot to go in fact they kind of looked around that well parties over time to go home. And you know that's. We felt that typically happens when immigration law enforcement is this this there are more people who go home in their own and who actually happen. Physically move by the US government. But let the ways. But while working back. You know you wouldn't seat somebody being pulled over for speeding slowdown yourself you know you don't need to actually issue -- tickets to sought to change -- behavior. So yeah that and that's you know it's not as recently as the early nineties. You could not get a green card if it was determined that it was going to be dependent on public this. We just simply wouldn't issue green -- that's nearly you know that we would immigration law was originally written -- people with self sufficient that we have a sponsor. Who would be responsible for helping support person that they needed and even today a sponsor of an immigrant had to sign an affidavit of support. That they are gonna take care -- be responsible for this person for at least five years senator never -- And in fact there you know people well if they don't have enough income that they can show on the tax returns to qualified to be able to -- an immigrant. Stable you know get other people to sign affidavits that are never enforced that would it is kind of --

If any drives folks -- easy because these are times when money is so tight. A lot of people need help American citizens need help. In distinct for instance that public tax Payer funded housing. It is legal immigrants are getting apartments. Head of head of American citizens. That's just wrong and yet it's happening all the time.

The you know one thing for refugees you know we understand we bring them here and understand that we are going to. I think this social service agencies and and private churches and other groups they're gonna help people become self sufficient. But you know the regular direct that they you know one million immigrants that we allowing legally here. That that's kind of eroded that idea that they would be self sufficient. And not need social services -- kind of have become obsolete. Just --

We certainly support Arizona's a sovereign right to pass the laws but it's all for no. If we do not do. What. Federal government is supposed to be doing which is securing our border.

That's the number one thing we have to do is secure our borders. And we all know the story welcome back by the way to the Charlie Manning show on WRKO 6172666868. We're joined by just -- ball and of the Center for Immigration Studies. Who is just the greatest expert I know on all these immigration. -- illegal immigration matters and immigration matters. But we all know that it was just about a month ago that one of the US senators from Arizona was meeting with the president he was begging him. Enforce the border enforce the border in the president's said. Look will never be -- if we enforce the border will never be -- get. Comprehensive. Immigration reform through. It all has to be part of the package so they're not even trying to enforce the border that's the problem is that just got.

If the problem they pretty much a band and any kind of immigration law enforcement except you know people who are like serial rape as -- and heard and thought -- There's no did turn it back to what they're doing because the method that people get it that. Let's keep your head down don't do anything major and in get a free pass to see here.

So you can imagine living in a border state what I mean that video and we still have -- up I think Chris don't we on our website. Dead video that you all released the couple weeks ago at the Center for Immigration Studies. That just show owes the -- legal immigrants marching through this. National park in -- you've got the hidden cameras there that you know war I touched off by motion detectors. And if they've got but guns they've got the drugs it's like watching an army invaded. It's scary if you haven't seen folks go to our website go to wrko.com. Click on the Charlie Manning page down at the bottom you can watch that video. In tell me that we don't need to enforce our borders it's crazy.

It's. And and Border Patrol knows about the trial to. They just are not allowed to -- do something about it. See. Department of the Interior has been able to successfully say oh we don't want you. Father the wildlife there or you know destroy any endangered plant you know Larry you know. Put these national park it rich when in fact it but it is being really trashed by the group of illegal aliens to come traffic.

6172666868. Let's go to some more calls yeah Arthur in the car your next -- just move -- from the Center for Immigration Studies hey Arthur.

They have -- pick in my car call archer Eliot -- distance that there's actual. The port so what part the third that I haven't you heard very popular book this is I think that -- the immigration. The way it's being careful should be a preacher BL Olympic debit the fact that not a course you want to describe whatever thirty this growing very. There are trying to say the word right I -- people have to Obey laws or why why why -- there was shot a lot from them. And another shuttle launch for the law abiding citizen.

Yeah -- Jessica how come.

But it's true I mean if I may use that fake Social Security number to try to do something then I would be prosecuted for that but. But look the other way when people do that because they quote -- just wanna work. In most states. It can drive and has suspended license. You're gonna get in big trouble if you cut and yet here in Massachusetts for example if you drive without a -- and in most cases you get a slap on the wrist.

We have what we had a rappel got we're ready to abided by it a drunken illegal immigrant. Who left that this is the one respect police problem except there's nothing you can do about it problem I'm going to be go back to Monrovia not going to be able to what -- outfit that. This state police officer and a rebel we have. -- still supports illegal immigration and benefits. That is the.

Only in Massachusetts are thorough -- in Massachusetts that.

What do what you're absolutely right -- you know -- eventually you know what the Republican audio me they have as much to blame. You know it says that required particle thought it was nothing been done about this. For the work forever for current -- integrated import a lot of the borders until that happens are we stuck to -- up all the Syria. Because politicians that brought that you are not put it over to go are turning a lot of representing American today we may need it nobody.

Well you know that's where of the Republican Party really fell down but I think they're getting the message now I mean when you think it was just a couple years ago. What was it in 2007. Tesco when President Bush himself. Was trying to push through comprehensive. Comprehensive. Always watch out -- that word. Immigration reform that would of that would have given 20000012. Million I don't know how many million illegal immigrants. And what do you call what's the term akin to get it amnesty yeah and and he was far -- the leader of the bill working with Ted Kennedy back then was John McCain. Who went on to. The nominee of the Republican party for president against Barack Obama so it just shows how out of step the Republican Party spent. But I do think we have some leaders who get it Senator McCain certainly has changed his tune. Mitt Romney did a great job on illegal immigration issues here in Massachusetts I remember when. Just give you you probably remember the story I didn't I think probably you do to -- there. By the legislature proposed giving driver's licenses to illegal immigrants. In Mitt heard about and he went out to a public press conference outside his office and went out there and said. Just tell the members of the legislature they did get a two thirds vote -- vetoing it and when -- arm a couple of days later I said. Mitt you should have played that out more you could've done a little statewide tour and told him in Pittsfield -- veto it then in Springfield then. You you cut it all off the all the media run that in one day and then of course the legislature stepped back in May yum. And they decided not to do that any block them from giving the the in state tuition rate to illegal immigrants he vetoed that. You know when he had that special arrangement with the state police to work with I east. In in turning override illegal immigrants here which of course Deval Patrick -- ended since he came into office so. There are some Republicans with a good record on illegal immigration are there.

And I think I like had kind of a blind spot on issues you know based on his childhood -- You know McCain who knows because who had I mean sometimes right like edition -- leadership matters because it made it very difficult for Republicans in congress. When the president President Bush was in pushing and immediately -- had them stand up for him. And they were some courageous people who did and they jointly and Democrats were able stop that would've been huge states.

Boy we came so close I'll never forget President Bush stay -- is this gonna pass and everything you've looked in the camera with that little George Bush look at my. Seen yet the deal sag and and I thought oh my god if they do this this will rule in the Republican party for generations. And thank god like you said. Some of those young democratic senators like. The task goal and and Webb from Virginia they were the ones that really made the difference and kept that from happening so. And joining with Republicans -- really made a difference let's go to while Roy in Cambridge your necks are telling -- and Jessica -- from the Center for Immigration Studies.

Before you get off tell us how to contact you Jessica I have two. Issues -- it has to do with the timing. Via an appeal to the Supreme Court there's three rules that'll allow -- to cut this time period short. -- rule eighteen allows a direct appeal a direct appeal from the United States district court to the US Supreme Court. And there's -- when he allows -- petition for an extraordinary writ. What that involves I don't know and then finally rule nineteen. Did it's procedure on a certified questions from the Court of Appeals which would require that -- I think the court itself is allowed to take any case it's in the federal system. And take you bring it before this Supreme Court if they think it's a sufficient. Public interest. So these ways are always of cutting it short whether any of them what happened is another issue and finally the one in -- questions have been decided by district court doesn't carry as much weight as when it is cited by the US Supreme Court so. Having your being ruled against in a lower court enables it to go up higher it's the only way to get it to Supreme Court is by ruling against it.

That they just staying and it it certainly would be in conflict if it went. But say is the ninth Circuit Court of Appeals and they agreed with judge Bolton that no part of it should be struck down. That would be I think. It not being a constitutional scholar but that was in conflict with some other ruling that have been made that might be an opportunity Q but -- it it is. I I have to say I don't know why you know the governor's thinking about what the next best bet is to what the council aside but it's not over. Sure that.

Deaths are short thanks of the call let's go to Jack in April your -- would just go -- from the Center for Immigration Studies.

I just got a -- that particular. Pleasure. Got two quick questions one is. Wouldn't be people who -- that green cast didn't -- on them. Have a chip the present that afford to get deported so I don't understand the judges. You know rationality. It took you mentioned something that just locked. Might have. -- the -- the you know -- out some of the Sanctuary -- or at least you know closing the loopholes and you'd think god. Cute on the net how that's gonna help. Against Sanctuary Cities.

Sure I'm -- I guess if someone who is illegal immigrants and it. Happen to count being countered by a police officer in Arizona. And they were arrested in what they -- or whatever well I think I'm. They would be done now in Arizona and almost all they -- program called your community. Where everything a person who is booked into jail. As part of the regular criminal history background check their fingerprints are sent to both the FBI and now all -- I. -- checked there immigration street and -- and that was immediately I'm not immediately picked a couple of hours. It would it would send a report back. In the -- and it is that the person has a green card they are not legally in that it -- they. Would not be faced with. But -- mobile. In just to let that happen in this program. Your music being rolled out all over the country. We started under the Bush Administration. And that then continued the Obama administration did fall one place now of the county's absentee habit and I hope that. Other share up eight. -- and other law enforcement agencies -- knocking on ice is stored and where we can get that program because it worked so well. And in make sure that. People who elected were illegal aliens don't often crack. So that's the first part on the sanctuary issue on the judge lets end this section of the Arizona Nevada that they. -- Any government agency in Arizona probably. Presenting it officials. From cooperating with federal immigration as part. There were few places in Arizona. That declared themselves sanctuary for illegal aliens. And so this law allows the state to. Crackdown on not an epic epic and federal lot of quite -- but we're not gonna be Obama administration to any of those jurisdictions. But.

There are there any chances that the group what -- a city like Baghdad a system that I mean I have heard -- that -- majority wanted to cities could. Any groups player aren't doing like a rebirth -- suit against these. Even a basic basically breaking federal law.

Yes they have. The Senate for immigration studies doesn't do it and by the way where at www. CIA dot org for the previous caller. But there isn't organization called the immigration reform law -- And that -- IRL I got ward. They are a public interest law firm that bring. Litigation and other legal action on behalf of citizen. It in the area of immigration law and immigration policy. For example they assisted in the defense. These are -- state trooper who was accused of racial profiling. And -- that the first Circuit Court near Boston that no reasonable suspicion and it's okay to ask someone. What about immigration status here the state trooper the loss was. So they have a really important role played. In this whole debate they helped Arizona. Draft a lot and they are actually I'm trying to do with the city of San Francisco for some of that sanctuary policy. Other public. It is not easy a lot of things have to fall in place but yeah out there they're the only organization I know all this out there. Trying to fight against Sanctuary City.

Thanks Jack appreciate it let's grab up here in New Bedford even year round would Jessica. -- would just go -- from the Center for Immigration Studies Napier.

87 -- here's what I would do I would I would use my imagination. And say that. I don't think Deval Patrick -- around I don't think. Obama is the road and I start using this suspect in the crime I'd start early in the morning I hope that the police officers listening -- state police lessening. Then I would go in just pick up. One illegal alien because that's he would do that there there are certain that their daughter says they're friends they're gonna start complainant. But just with that one you -- can already.

text or call one more call here from west for you Iran would just goes -- at the Center for Immigration Studies hey Peter.

Are you I loved ones Jessica dawn because she had you know -- being -- down pat. Perez and I don't.

She's terrific go -- Peter. Paul did we lose appear after you waited all that time. Gosh that I -- yeah I know well you should see some of these text that says. Here's one from in -- move burn it says. -- a wasp -- go to Jessica so you're getting good text you're getting good calls -- getting good readings here Jessica and we appreciate it will.